5/23/22 - iRetire4Him Show 62: A Fruitful Retirement, Part 4

Intro: While retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self focus. God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The Retirement Reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in retirement to embrace the calling. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop, you can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him.

Jim: You've tuned into, iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. We're reaching out to you. The 50 million Christ followers in America who are already retired are on their way to retirement. We're so gratefully tuned in today. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg. And I'm joined by Bruce Bruinsma the founder of the Retirement Reformation. You might wanna know what that's all about. Go to RetirementReformation.org, RetirementReformation.org. Christians are called to ministry for a lifetime impacting and changing lives is more than a priority for God. It is his mandate to us. This mandate the call on our lives has a couple of parts, the common call for all believers to minister, while impacting others and helping to change lives.

Then there is the unique call, which is based on our unique set of gifts, talents, and abilities. But how does all that play out in our retire? Retirement is not only a reward for past service, but is a stepping stone, a launching pad for future ministry. And as Bruce says, a future funded, fully funded ministry, Bruce Bruinsma were the founder of the Retirement Reformation just released his latest book in the future funded ministry series.

And it's called A Fruitful Retirement. The result of a future funded ministry plan. Bruce joined this today for our final podcast of the four part series. Talking about how your retirement ears can be a fruitful retire. Bruce welcome back to iRetire4Him.

Bruce: Now, Jim, the conversations we've had in the prior three podcasts have, have really illuminated what start starts to illuminate more, what, what fruitful really means and the value of that. So much opportunity, so much opportunity and, and the reward that comes from being fruitful is so much greater than the reward that comes from doing nothing.

Jim: On chapter nine of, of A Fruitful retirement, you say, and I quote you, everything you've experienced, learned and accomplished has prepared you for the next phase of life, retirement. How is that true? Give us an example from your life.

Bruce: 1989 was in a circumstance where I was challenged to make a trip to the end of the world. Literally. The end of the world can, is best personified by the name of a town it's called Timbuktu. Matter of fact, most people would wonder if it town really exists.

It is literally in the country of Molly. It's in the middle of a desert and, and there are no roads to get there. So I was challenged to go there. I thought, well, that's the craziest thing I've ever heard, not traveled much at that time in my life, outside the country. To be called to the end of the world.

And I had a decision to make, would I go, or would I not pretty simple. I made the decision to go and. I went to Timbuk two and spent about a week there and it is in the middle of nowhere. And it's kind of that picture, you know, of the, of the French Legionnaire crawling through the sand and, you know, with his tongue hanging out, trying to get another water.

That's that's where Timbuktu is. It is the end of the world. I thought the reason that I was going there was because I needed to have a conversation. With missionaries in a desolate place. It's another story to unpack at another time, but I went and did that and got the answer to that question. It probably wasn't till maybe almost 15 years later, maybe 20, where I realized that a secondary, but more important reason was my answer to God's question: will you go?

That answer has shaped the rest of my life. We talked in another segment about listening to God's call and being available. Well, how do you know if you're gonna be available? Well, guess what? The way you know, is if you're available, how do you know if you will go because you went and.

Whether it's to a neighbors across the street, across the city, across the state, around the world, it doesn't matter. Are you available? And will you go, God promises that if you will be his messenger and allow his word to. Be expressed through your life and for the things that he calls you to do, he will then prepare you.

He will make you ready. He will then use that to be able to build his kingdom. And so when we talk about being fruitful, the first step in being fruitful is to be available. The second one is to go. The third one is to listen to what he want is to understand. The lessons that you are to learn that will, that will impact all the rest of the things that you do.

And one of the great things about longevity is you have an opportunity to have those experiences and to be able to reflect on them. That was an experience 1989, not a long time ago, but it affects my life today. When a challenge and opportunity situation comes. And the question is, will I step into it as God's representative?

And I've lived long enough now that I can say in the affirmative yes, I will. When I was 30, I couldn't say that now. I can not only say it, but I can do it first.

Jim: A lot of people look at retirement and thank you for sharing that story. A lot of people look at retirement as an ending of sorts, but it's really a new beginning and you just described.

The transformational paradigm, shifting moment in your own life. And, and this new beginning usually relates to taking all that God has woven into the tapestry of our lives and matching it with a fresh calling or assignment. How do we know, maybe I answer this question? How did you know what that calling was for you?

Bruce: When I was a boy who lived in grand rapids, Michigan. Had a lot of friends in the area, there was a, a woods, there was lots of places to roam and to go. And so on. I know when it was time to come home for dinner, your stomach was gone. My dad had a whistle. Oh, okay. My dad had a whistle and it was, I don't know if I can do it.

My lips are drying up, but it was his and his whistle could penetrate. The forest, the trees, the anything that was going on. And when I heard that whistle, I knew it was time to come home here. God calling it's time to listen. How do you know that God is calling? Cause he's opened a door. He shut a door. He speaks audibly.

He speaks through someone else. He speaks through scripture. All the different ways that he speaks to us. He speaks to us in visions, all the different ways that he speaks to us. But when he does choosing his methodology for us to be open listening and available, that's all I can tell you.

Jim: I love the real and raw examples, Bruce. So, so grateful for that. When we come back, second segment of the show, we're gonna have Art Nutter with us today. You're gonna love to hear his story. You're listening to, iRetire4Him. We'll be right back.

Break: Hey listeners, we would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book of fruitful retirement. Head out to RetirementReformation.org / books.

You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including a fruitful retire. Retirement Reformation.org/books. That's RetirementReformation.org / books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg. And of course we're always joined by Bruce Bruinsma by the founder of the Retirement Reformation and Bruce, during the second segment of every show you bring on a special guest, who do you have for us today?

Bruce: I'd like to introduce our audience to my friend Art. Art and I have had an opportunity to get to know each other in a variety of different ways through being part of a CEO leadership group.

And one of the things that, that always attracted me to you, art was that you're the kind of person that the average person would say. Shouldn't you be retired and man, you seem to be working a lot and doing that. That's the kind of same things they say to me. So we've got a kinship there, but I know my story, but we need to share some of your story with our, with our readers. So what are you doing and what keeps you going?

Art Nutter: Well what I'm doing is in the we're making patent licensing more efficient for everybody around the world. And why I do this because I had a voice. I heard literally a voice from God. I was in my, I was in my sauna here at my house and I hear this voice that says, Art, I'd like you to make patent transactions more efficient around the world. I'm like, this is weird. Okay.

I'm the only guy in the sauna, but it was as clear as, as I'm talking to you right now and I'm thinking, all right, I had to sit there and, and pray about this and say, all right, well, was this real? And, you know, occasionally the holy spirit does allow these things to happen.

And and I'm like, well, I guess I have all the elements necessary to enable patent licensing to, to be effective efficiently. And so I started trying on this concept around, around the world. And so talking to all my customers, IBM Intel, Microsoft Qualcomm, you know, Samsung, Fujitsu, blah, blah, blah.

These are all my customers. I said, what if we did this patent licensing thing in a way similar to the way music is licensed today? Because you know, we, we, with our shiny heads here have transitioned between when music was distributed on vinyl. Through to tapes then CDs, then MP3s. And now most many people around the world consume music through a subscription service, either through apple music or Spotify, pay one price and listen to all the music you want, where I figure we can do something very, very similar to that in patents.

Bruce: You know, I find it, I find it interesting because. Everywhere. We turn everybody that we interview here, but the people that I meet, you know, each one of us is unique and yet God finds a way to use those, those skills and those talents in a way that will be, will answer an issue for the world, but also an issue for building the kingdom.

So answer me this question. When your feet hit the floor, first thing in the morning, mm-hmm, , what's going through your head?

Art Nutter: Well I'm I I'm, I'm, I'm paying attention to the readings. I'm a Catholic guy. And so the universal Catholic church has the same readings every single day, no matter where you are in the church, anywhere in the world.

Okay. So I, first thing I do get up. I put some clothes on and I listen to the readings as I get in my car and head to mass, because quite often I get asked to help out with the responsorial Psalm or something like that during the mass. But I ha I, as a result of another miracle that I was a beneficiary of, actually one of my daughters was a beneficiary of it.

I made a deal with God, so to speak. To go to mass every single day. And I've been doing that now for 12 years straight because my daughter almost died back when the swine flu was going around the world. And intercession of St. Gianna Mola, patron saint of pregnant moms. She's back and we have a granddaughter as a result of that and very, very cool things.

Bruce: Well, that's, you know, the, we, we talk in the Retirement Reformation messaging. That in fact, one of the benefits of growing older is that we can, that we can, that we can become closer to God. Yes. And that we can grow with our emotional maturity. Now our bodies may, you know, the hair may fall out. Our bodies may yeah, start to deteriorate. We may forget some things now. And then we may slow down a little, but I think those, those BA the on balance, the, the, the benefits that come. From age, certainly outweigh the challenges that come from age. Do you agree with that? Is that what you found?

Art Nutter: No question. No question, Bruce. In fact I participate in Eucharistic adoration on a night, on a nightly basis, not nightly, but at three o'clock in the morning on Thursday mornings, Friday mornings and Sunday mornings, I go in and adore the blessed sacrament and a blessed sacrament adoration chapel at our, at our parish. Okay. It's the first one that was ever been established in the history of the city of Colorado Springs.

It's been going for 24 7 now for the last five north of five years. Anyhow, I'm in there adoring our Lord. And he's talking to me exactly about what you're talking about because as we do age, we get influenced less and less by our external environment and influenced more and more by our internal and spiritual environment.

And, and so I'm, I'm reading stuff by Saint Augustin and St. Francis and a couple other dudes. And they're saying, yep, this is all, this is process where you get closer and closer to God, indeed.

Bruce: Well, that's, that's good. So do you, do you have a sense that your work with the patent books and, and to make patenting and, and its usage and so on simpler? Do you have a sense of is there any unique ways that that particularly impacts the church or the kingdom?

Oh, absolutely.

Art Nutter: Absolutely. Okay. Tell me what that is. Well it's, it's multifaceted and it's really kind of fun. I enjoy speaking in front of audiences and the largest audience that I've been speaking to about patent books was about 2000 people in the audience.

Okay. These are all licensing guys, you know, around the world and all that. And. I get up there and I tell them flat out the, the, the story of how this came about, you know, this, this voice in the sauna, the God, all this stuff. And, and I get commentary after my, my talk, they say, all right. I felt like I was at a tent revival or something like that.

I said, oh, you could be in a worse place. Okay. And and the other way that this will profoundly affect things. This allows people to communicate and work together. Because the holy spirit is in every one of us. And, and we come up with these artificial boundaries, you know, with these COVID masks and everything else like that, that are, that are even emphasized that further.

But, you know, we, we, humans are, are supposed to interact with one another because this gets back to St. Paul's description of the body of. There's different parts of the body have different skills and inventors, if they can't eat because nobody's paying for the use of their invention. Well, then they're gonna have to go do something else.

They're gonna have to flip burgers or something like that. And we lose the capability of those inventors and their inventions. Because if they can get paid for them efficiently, guess what? They'll probably do more inventing. That's a good thing for all of us.

Bruce: Well, and you know, we were all created in the likeness of God and, and he's a pretty inventive fellow. If he was inventive enough to have, have created the three of us that are on the rable - that and giraffes. He's got both a sense of humor and a wide of a variety of skills. Well, Art, thank you so much for being part of it. Your story is, is unique and as every story is unique, Jim, do you have a question?

Jim: I do. Art, I wanna know. So you, you, growing up Catholic you're, you're an avid Catholic. You've heard enough homiles that you could stack it from here to the moon. Did you ever imagine that God cared so much about business, that he gave you specific business instructions that, that, that he said, here's what I want you to architect? Were you surprised actually?

Art Nutter: Yes and no. I mean, I, I I'm, I like to just pay attention to what the good Lord's saying. Right? And I will tell you that Pope Benedict the 16th, before he resigned and, and Pope Francis took over, put together this big old list of things that the church needed to pay attention to there's and it was a list of about 30 line items in there.

And like it, somewhere in the twenties there, it said the church needs to communicate more effectively with the world of science. I'm like, pick me, pick me. That's a guy. I, I live in science land. Okay. But the fact is my, my, my faith drives a lot of my interactions here. And in fact, if you go back and you take a look at history, the church has been very, very influential and supportive of scientific developments over the year. That doesn't mean that we didn't do some dumb things in along way.

Jim: We're not gonna go there today. Art.

Art Nutter: Oh, exactly. Okay. But the church is run by humans and humans do stupid human tricks from time to time okay. But the church overall guided it by the holy spirit. Right? Gets there without some, you know, obviously bumps in the road cuz sohow yeah.

I feel blessed to be part of this because one of the other things I hope to do is make catholic education completely free for anybody who would like to go to a Catholic school here in the diocese of Colorado Springs.

Jim: At some point in time, if they can all walk away with a faith as deep as yours, I'm all for it. That's fantastic. Bruce, back to you,

Bruce: Art, thank you so much, my friend, I appreciate it. We look forward to our next conversation. Thanks for making the time today. Sharing your story. And it is one of those unique stories and it's appreciated. And and we just want to be an encouragement to you. As I know, you've been encouragement to our listeners. So thanks, Art, and have a great day.

Art Nutter: Thank you very much, Bruce. And Jim, God bless both of you.

Jim: You bet. You've been listening to. iRetire4Him. We'll be right back.

Break: Hey listeners, we would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book of fruitful retirement. Head out to RetirementReformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement, Retirement Reformation.org/books. That's RetirementReformation.org / books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation, Bruce. You and I are talking about your book, the, A Fruitful Retirement book, four of a four series books series right now.

So far, man. I know that. Could be more. I know that you're, you know, you're always looking to write more and it's the future funded ministry series I wanna hit on. Ah, well, there's so many things I wanna hit on, but you know, you mentioned you quote Richard and Leon Bergstrom in your book. One of our past guests, they were they're our past guests on the show.

When you wrote, we believe retirement is not the ending, but it is time for breathing examining, resting, slowing down, renewing. Why is it so hard for ourselves, Bruce, to give ourselves permission, to do the things, to do any of those things. Examining, breathing, resting, slowing down. As we prepare for retirement and to walk in retirement, why is it so hard for those four things? Breathing, examining, resting, and slowing down.

Bruce: Every morning, when I get up five days a week,

Jim: You don't get up all seven? You only get up five days a week?

Bruce: I only get up five days. The other two I'm... Five days a week that I, during the week and Judy and I get up around 4:30 and we head for the gym and we, you know, and we work out for about 45, 50 minutes and come home every morning when I, my feet hit the floor.

I think, man, do I really wanna do this today? Or do I really want to go back to bed? And what I learned was. When I give myself permission to do what I should do that I am. That's when I go from sitting on the edge of the bed to standing up and getting ready and ready to go. We give our need to give ourselves permission.

And we started doing this by the way about two years ago now I was 78 years, years old. When we started doing this, say, my goodness, you should have started doing that when you were, you know, 20 or 30 or 40 or 50 or 60 or 70, but it didn't happen till then. So to be able to say, you know, this is something that, that will really be helpful and to give, give ourselves permission to do.

I think in the same way, when there is something new that it comes into our lives and our understanding a new reality, a new truth that in fact, we need to give ourselves permission to do those things. And it's hard to do that because we've never done it before yet when you do it, the result is so, so positive, so energizing, so helpful.

And yet the next time you do it, it still feels strange until it becomes what, until it becomes somewhat of a habit. Right. And we're able to do that. Same thing is true with those characteristics that, that Richard and Leonna talk about because they're all part of the preparation for what's next. They are not an end in themselves.

They're part of the preparation. When I go work out. It's part of a preparation for staying strong to be available of what's next. And, and these are the things that are necessary when we make that transition into retirement and often between the stages of retirement, to be able to take those activities and give yourself permission to do them. Because they aren't then in themselves, they're a preparation for what's next.

Jim: And what's so funny as young people, we hardly ever give ourselves permission to breathe, to examine, to rest or to slow down. I mean, yeah, I'm a few years younger than you. I'm not giving myself much time for that. Ain't nobody got time for that.

That's what we always say, Bruce. I, I wanna finish up the show really focusing on. The six big questions that everybody needs to answer. And, and, and I know I told you what page was on, so make sure we, we, we did this because you say in your book only you can answer these questions, but these six complex retirement questions, they need our best answers. Why don't you go through what those questions are? And, and let's talk about ' em.

Bruce: Very quickly, it's it is a new season. And so there are then new choices. When there are new choices, it means that there are new questions. When there are new questions, you need to answer them in order to be able to take the next steps that kind of just is logical and makes sense.

But often we don't think of it in that, that sequential or that clearer pattern. So, so the first question for, for you and, and you and your spouse. Simply now, how are we going to relate to each other in our new set of circumstances, if I'm home all day, it's gonna make a huge difference. Then if in fact we are separate, how are we going to, you know, how are we going to relate to each other?

And that's an important question. And it's, it's one that can have some specific answers, but it's also a process. The second one is, so what are we gonna do? What are we gonna do? Are we gonna travel? Are we gonna play golf? We gonna play bridge or we're gonna work some more at the church, or we're gonna try to find something individually or together that will bring meaning in purpose.

That is an intentional answer, an intent, an intentional activity that is critical. Now here's the one that really gets to it as a matter of fact. It's where are we going to do it? Mm. Our experience is that that's the most divisive question in most families.

Jim: Why is that so divisive?

Bruce: Often and you I'll just pose a, a circumstance. So, so whatever the whether the, let's say the husband was say in the military, They gotta move. Every three years, somebody was telling 'em exactly where they gotta go and what they gotta do, or someone is in the mission world. And they were called to missions in here and there, or wherever it was now often, often the wife, but not necessarily says, okay, For the last 40 years or 30 years, we've either had people tell us, or you've decided, or the circumstance decided of where we're gonna live. Now I'm gonna speak into that.

Jim: It's about time.

Bruce: And so we gonna live near the kids, or we gonna live away from the kids. Are we gonna live someplace where there's things that we enjoy doing hiking and whatever it may be, or are we going to go someplace that we can afford? Are we gonna move to a small town in Indiana or in Idaho?

Or are we gonna go to a retirement community in Florida? And so all these living circumstances are probably the messiest and the most difficult to determine. My only wise advice on that would be is come to the best conclusion you can and be prepared to move again. Yeah, because that's most likely what's gonna happen.

Yeah. So part of that then answers the question of who are we gonna do retirement with? Is it gonna be, you know, our friends of the last 20 years, or are we gonna go someplace and make some new ones? Who are we gonna, or are we going to be dedicated to our parents for, or family? Yeah. Family. Yeah. Family and parents.

So who are we gonna do retirement with? And, and the only two things you can be sure of. When you, when, when you move is that you will have to make new friends. And the other issue is that you take yourself with you. You don't leave yourself in that old place. You take it with you. So, and there's a lot of implications of that.

Then finally, of course, how are we gonna finance it? Having a pretty good sense of, of what that is. It's amazing to me. How people. So let's say they're 64 and they're gonna retire at 65 and I'm speaking with them. And I, I ask them, by the way, how much does it cost you every month to live? They have no idea.

The paycheck's worth is the unsaid answer. So to be intentional about that, and then what is really important to you? What are your priorities? What's really important to you? And it may be different for a husband and a wife. And so to be able to understand what's important to your spouse and be able to support, encourage whatever that is, as well as, as vice versa.

And so those are the, those are top six questions that if you can answer those. So who are you if you sum it up? As in the beginning of that chapter, I tell a story. and it's says, ask the question, who are you? And where are you going?

Jim: Hmm. Those six questions again, how are we going to relate to each other?

What are we going to do? Where are we gonna do it? Who are we gonna do it with? How are we gonna finance it? And what is most important in retirement, Bruce, those are powerful questions and the questions that everybody needs to ask in order to experience. A Fruitful Retirement, a great way to end this, Bruce, what a great book, a resource that all of you listeners, all of us can get a copy online on Amazon or on Retirement Reformation.org.

Along with many of the other books of Bruce's, bruce has written. Bruce, any final thoughts before we say goodbye to the part four of four series on A Fruitful Retirement, any final words?

Bruce: Oh, only that the call to fruitfulness is a call that Jesus makes on our lives and he makes it because he loves us cheers for us, and he wants the best for us. And when we are fruitful, we will experience the best.

Jim: Thank you, Bruce. You've been listening to iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation online at RetirementReformation.org. I've been privileged to be your host, Jim Brangenberg. And along with Bruce Bruinsma, with the founder of the Retirement Reformation we're Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation, so we can ultimately say iRetire4Him!

Outro: Thanks for listening to, iRetire4Him. With your host, Jim and Martha Brangenberg and Retirement Reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma. iRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement.

However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to love. Serve and help others. This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and money and invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you, the Retirement Reformation is encouraging Christians.

To find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life, especially in retirement. Take time to sign the manifesto at retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirementreformation.org.

5/9/22 - iRetire4Him Show 61: A Fruitful Retirement, Part 3

Intro: While, retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self focus. God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The Retirement Reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in retirement to embrace the. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop, you can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him!

Jim: Reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are already in retirement or fast approaching you've tuned into, iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. I'm your host, Jim Brangenburg, along with the founder of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce Bruinsma, check us out online retirementreformation.org.

We have a ton of resources, written resources, audio resources. We've got all kinds of website resources. Plans. We've got, we've got it all. When it comes to revolutionizing the way you look at retirement, we've got it all - retirementreformation.org.

Christians are called to ministry for a lifetime impacting and changing lives is more than a priority it's God's mandate for every one of us. This mandate the call in our lives has two parts. The common golfer, all believers is dominion. Well impacting others and helping to change lives. Then there is our unique call, which is based on our unique set of gifts, talents, and abilities. But how does all that play out in our retirement? Retirement's not all a reward for past service, but also a stepping stone, a launching pad for a future ministry as Bruce Bruinsma would say if future fully funded ministry, first prize, but joins us today, the founder of the Retirement Reformation.

Cause he just released his latest book in the future funded ministry series. And it's called the results of a future funded ministry plan. Bruce joins us today for part three of a four part series, talking about how your retirement years can be fruitful. Bruce, welcome back to I'll retire for him.

Bruce: Oh, there's lots to talk with you, Jim, and particularly, but when we're talking about a topic as encouraging as this. The, the affirmation that we are, the, the direction that we are to be fruitful. And the affirmation that when we are the wonderful benefits that come from it.

Jim: First, you sold your company in 2020. You wanted to, because you wanted to devote more time and energy to helping people successfully navigate retirement. But you had to figure out that for yourself too. Didn't you?

Bruce: It's it's an ongoing challenge as we come to each stage of life. And, and if our audience would just think back, you know, when you made the transition from your twenties to your thirties, from your thirties to your forties and forties to fifties, there, there are always things that you had to figure out.

Some of them were forced on you and you had to figure it out. And then there are some that you just kind of didn't understand and you needed to figure out well, in, in, in my case figuring it out is still an ongoing process because you have to figure it out a number of different times that, that chat, that change from career, if you wish, or company ownership to not or from career to not, you got to figure that out.

And if you can get a leg up by understanding what's coming and know what's true, that helps you to figure it out. I will say I'm still figuring. Well, you also we'll figure it out again when you go into that next second stage and then to the third stage. So it's, you know, in the vernacular, it's a constant process of figuring out and enlisting to what God has you to do during during that time.

Jim: Is it any really different than what Paul said? We had to work out our faith. You're working out your retirement because you're working out your retirement in your faith. It's like the same thing. You're wrestling with God to go, okay, what's next? Just because there's this word, retirement plastered over. It doesn't mean it's any different, does it?

Bruce: No. The you know, the whole idea of retirement comes out of the industrial revolution and we've talked about that at other other podcasts and the way that all develop, but it's a, it's a cultural, it's a cultural issue. It is not a, that that then becomes a life. And the, and the challenge is that when it is a life issue and you're going from being fairly clear about what you're retiring from to either not having any idea or having perhaps a not complete idea of what in fact is coming next, then the struggle to sort through it becomes much harder, much more confusing and much more difficult.

Not only do we have the relationships between. Figure it out for ourselves, but figuring it out in relation to our spouse we interviewed, we did an interview with, with a woman who wrote a book and talking about, you know, what do you do when your husband's home all the time from a husband's standpoint, what do you do when you're home all the time and you can't find the peanut butter, what do you do?

You go to your wife and you ask her where's the peanut butter. And she looks at you. You've got two heads. Why don't you go back to your study? I'll bring you the dumb peanut butter. And so we have all these things to figure out what she might say.

Jim: She might say, oh honey, I'll tell you. She might not be mad at you unless you've asked for 50 times.

Bruce: Yeah. It's when it's a constant process, you don't know where anything is and you keep bugging her about where they are.

Jim: In all your books. Bruce, you talk about the three phases of retirement that, that it's, that it's not just all one phase that it's broken up into three phases, but it's really talking about how do our listening friends find the right activities to match their phase in life and their phase in retirement to see, okay, God, how can you use me best? How do they find out what's best?

Bruce: Well, we, we, first of all, we have a universal mandate that we can all see very quickly. Love your neighbor and spread the word. So on a general basis, that's always a wonderful place to start. Am I loving my neighbor? And am I spreading the word now? Then you go to the unique part of how God calls us to be able to do that, to be able to love our neighbor and spread the word.

We had an interview with my friend Art Nutter, and he's developing something called patent books, and it's a whole new, big deal. I got another friend that what, what he's called to do is to love the four houses on either side of him and the people that are in it and specials. So we have the general mandate, love your neighbor, spread the word, then how do we fit into God's plan to be able to do.

Jim: It's really managing our freedom, make us as so many people retire from, to do the retire from something to do nothing. And they've got this new found freedom and they're, they're trying to figure out what's the reality of this situation. I mean, this freedom is it's a lot to handle. It's like somebody giving you a hundred grand, what are you doing?

If you're going to be smart, you're going to ask the Lord what you should do with it. But a lot of us are just like, I got this freedom. I'm gonna do whatever I wanna do.

Bruce: Actually, you know, Jim, when you think about it during our working years, it was much simpler. You know, when you got up in the morning, you went to work unless it was Saturday and you did, you did honeydews and on Sunday you went to church, you know, it was all kind of laid out for you now, you know, the, the good news is that we have freedom.

The bad news is that we often don't know what to do with it. And so to be able to take those God's principles and those applications and apply them during that during this time, it's also going to be not just one answer, but it's going to be a continued growing and changing process.

Jim: And what are some of those freedoms that the people are going to experience during the retirement years?

Bruce: Well, we got, first of all, the most obvious one is you have the freedom of. You get to choose, what are you going to do? How long are you going to sleep in? When are you going to do when you get up, et cetera, et cetera. So, so you have the freedom of time. And the challenge is to be intentional and a good steward of that time.

So I can, you have your emotions. And so you have a greater freedom to be able to express them and to be able to research and so on. So, so you have that peace now you've got the freedom. To what degree are you going to grow spirits? And you have the freedom to choose. Are you in fact, going to read your Bible?

Are you not, are you going to pray or are you at, you're going to go for a walk in the woods and listen to God talking to you or are you not? And so you have the freedom of choice and so that wonderful freedom of choice is, is just what a great benefit unless you don't use it. And, you know, Hey, all those areas where stewardship is real and turn that into nothing.

Jim: So, so where do you find yourself, Bruce Bruinsma? Where do you find yourself working in those freedoms that you've been given in your retirement years? Where do you find yourself focused the most?

Bruce: Well, I have the intentionality of, of helping the 15 million Christ followers. As you say, in the introduction, to think differently about this area of retirement. And the reason is because we don't have very many models. If we had a lot of models, there would be no reason for me to do this. But in fact, he's called to call me to do this and to invite thousands of others into the same conversation expressed in their life and to be able to make a difference for the kingdom.

I really feel the intense loss. Oh, the fact that there are probably 45, 50 million Christ followers or in this retirement age, or just coming into it or are in it and really are doing nothing. Hmm. And I, I, you know, it makes me cry. It just, it, it hurts that that's true because it doesn't need to be true what it is that they are losing and what it is that the kingdom is losing.

You don't have to be that way. All of us know somebody right in our world that it's say, oh my gosh, don't they get it? Don't don't don't they understand that they're, they're part of causing their own pain? And in that, that if they get it, it's, it's the same pain. It's, it's another version of the pain that, that we have as Christians for the world... if they only knew Jesus...

it would make such a difference in the same thought process. If they only knew what Jesus wanted for them and is made available to them, it would make such a difference. And yet most of our world doesn't get it. And so we're about doing everything we possibly can to change that for Christ followers.

So that in fact, meaning and purpose. And impacting the kingdom so that in fact, they can be assured that when they stand in front of the father and he says, good and faithful servant to the very end.

Jim: Right. Very good. All right, we'll be right back and more. And iRetire4Him with our special second segment guest, Mario Zandstra. Listening to iRetire4Him. Check us out online retirementreformation.org.

Break: Hey listeners. We would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement. Head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including a fruitful retirement.

RetirementReformation.org/books. That's retirementreformation.org/books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. Bruce, during every second segment of every podcast we've ever done, he was bring on a special guest. Who do you have for us today?

Bruce: Well, I like to introduce our audience to Marios Zandstra. And it's always just a special pleasure when I have the opportunity to connect with someone with a name like , because it reminds me of Bruinsma and that reminds both of us, of our Dutch heritage. And so we automatically know we have points of connection.

And that's really good. So Mario, we welcome and, and we're, we're, the audience is going to be pleased to hear a little bit about your story. So let's kind of begin with that. Give us just a quick executive summary of who is Mario Zandstra and how'd you get to where you are.

Mario Zandstra: Well, thank you for asking Bruce. It's good to be with you. And you know, that whole Dutch heritage, you know, you ain't Dutch, you ain't much is kind of the, is kind of a, we like to say it. So you know, I was born in the Netherlands, actually moved to the United States when I was a little boy. And I was raised in a home in east Los Angeles and went to the university of Southern California.

Ultimately got a degree in business and was one of those guys who's just going to spend my life making money. And and I did that for the better part of 17 years. And then I read a little book called Halftime by Bob Buford and it kinda rocked my world.

Bruce: Well, Ithat book rocked a lot of people's world.

Jim: Millions of people.

Mario Zandstra: That's right. Well, I read that book and it at the ripe old age of 38 or 39, I actually wrote a plan that was going to take me from the business world into the ministry world. But I, I thought I was going to be a pastor. That was my, my my desire. And anyway, in that in God's funny sense of humor, I was on the board of a ministry and their executive director left and they were looking for a ministry guy with business experience to hire. And then they switched the job description to a business guy with ministry, passion. And I saw that job description and low behold, I became a candidate.

Bruce: And how has that worked out?

Mario Zandstra: Well, I spent 17 years running a Christian camp in Tyler, Texas called pine Cove Christian camp. And in my previous life, I was in the commercial real estate development business and brokerage business.

And so we, we would raise money, build buildings and we would be compensated based on the internal rate of return and And then I ended up going to work for this Christian camp. And we had three camps when we started nine camps when I left. And basically I was still in the real, real estate development business, but instead of an internal rate of return, I was working on an eternal rate of return.

And some 30,000 kids came to Christ over the course of my 17 years. And that ministry now is 55 years old.

Bruce: It's a wonderful a wonderful facility and, and you know, it, they're almost any group that you're speaking to say, how many of you have been impacted in your spiritual walk by a time at a camp and the number of hands that go up as amazing.

And so you're, you're part of the cause of that. And so we want to thank you for those 17 years. So what are, what's a couple of the lessons that you've learned and in that period of time, and then since. That, that, that help you during this period of time that the world calls retirement. But all it is is just a refocusing of how we do ministry.

Mario Zandstra: Well, what's interesting is, is that you know, I left pine Cove and I went and worked for a season for Dr. Tim Keller and working for him, gave me a heart for the world. And then I worked at a mission agency and we did work in 49 scary countries. And then then, you know, it's just funny how God works.

So I had real estate experience. I had camp experience and then I had leadership experience and had a chance to take over a ministry that had a camp. Owned a bunch of property in Zambia and needed a new leader. And so I think, I think what I've learned the most is that, is that a, you know, you've got to have a willingness to be available.

You've got to have a willingness to exercise the talents that God has given you. And ultimately when you think about you know, the way you're involved to always give glory to God, the work that happened at Pine Cover was not me. It was God in me and and God assembled a great team there. And God has assembled a great team where I'm working.

Bruce: You know, the the, the process that you talked about, the, the first of all being available, you know, that's more important than anything else. You gotta be willing to walk through the door and if you're not willing to walk through the door, nothing, secondly, is that, is that to be able to, to look at all the experiences that all of us have, every one of our lists.

As experiences and that prepares them for what's next, whether they know what's next or they're just simply open to what's next. Right. That's right. So talk a little bit about what it means to be open to what's next. What does that feel like? What does that, what does that look like?

Mario Zandstra: Well, you know, for me, and maybe you fall in this category, Bruce, I'm a recovering control freak, and, and as a recovering control freak, you know, it's very hard to think about.

Actually surrendering your plans or surrendering your will to, to, to God himself. I actually wrote a song once and it was entitled. I surrender almost all and you know what, you know how you do it, you surrender things and then you take them back from God, you surrender them. But what I've found really simply over the last 10 years is that and God's ways were always better than mine.

But he has a plan and it's, and it's perfect. And he's actually known about it before he uttered the words in the beginning. And and so it really has to do with listening to the still small voice of God. And I would also say that in my case my wife has had a profound impact on many of the things that I've done.

As a matter of fact, this job, I had the job description for it, and I was giving it to a friend and I had the job description sitting on a dining room table at our house. And I left it there overnight, forgot to grab it the next morning. And I came home from work and my wife said that job actually describes you.

And I said, oh man, I'm never going to work in Zambia. I mean, come on. We live in the United States, we've got a great life. We've got all these grandkids. And anyway, never say never. First of all, I, you know, not only did Justin Bieber say that, but, but I can say that as well. Never say never to God. And it's just amazing to think that.

Really used my wife to actually open my eyes to that opportunity. And you know, our wives have a very unique opportunity to kind of speak into our lives. And you know, we don't always like what they say, but, but it really has made a big difference in my life. I would say two or three of the biggest business decisions, ministry decisions, career decisions I made of my wife actually probably had more to do with it than me.

She, she could see. God had a plan that was maybe one that I didn't fully understand.

Bruce: Well, God intended us to grow and to learn from each other and to do it in community and with our spouses, that's you know, that's a pretty special community and then it extends from there. And so if we continue to be exposed, whether it be to a book, whether it be to a podcast, whether it be to an individual whether it be to a job.

That we see just simply that openness of being available and then being willing to listen to that still small voice and to recognize it, I think recognizing is the first step. And then being willing to listen is the, is the second. And it comes to all of us in different ways. But to know that that's true and God is always out.

Well, Mario, that's a you know, you you've, we thank you for your fruitful life and the fruitful life. That's ahead. And we say in the retirement reclamation that the, that a fruitful life has meaning and purpose in life. And then that, that leads to joy and freedom. And so there we go. Jim, did you have a question?

Jim: I did - Mario okay. So Bruce and I have been talking to in a, in a series on his book, a fruitful retirement, and one of the things we've been talking about is this unretiremint and it already sounds like you've unretired a couple of times. What do you think is next in your unretired?

Mario Zandstra: Well, you know, it's interesting. So I I'm 65 and you know, 65 is the new 50 really.

I mean, I believe I got a lot of time left. I've got a lot of energy left. I've got a lifetime worth of experiences. And if you, if you think about the stages of life you know, you're a lover, that's ages one through 20, you're a warrior that's from your early twenties to your mid forties. Then you become a king and then you become a Sage.

And I think really in some ways for Bruce and myself and perhaps you too, we're kind of in the Sage years of life. So, so for example, I met with a gentleman today he's 54 and he's trying to figure out a little bit more about life and we just talked about, well, you know, what's, what is your desire over the next five years?

And what has God laid on your heart? And so I think, I think part of it is mentoring people coming alongside people and helping them really. Think through, you know, what, what might God have in store? And then, you know, I mean, I'm, I'm an evangelist by, by personality. I'm a teacher and you know what I hate to waste.

I hate to waste those talents. And so looking for different opportunities to share I think is, is being prudent, is trying to steward the time, the talent and the treasure. In a way that would bring glory and honor to God.

Bruce: Wow. My friend. It doesn't get any better than that. So let's just stop right there. Mario, Thank you so much for making time to be available with us and look forward to having you back on iRetire4Him and we can extend the conversation and the wisdom that God has blessed you with. And so thank you for sharing it. We appreciate it.

Mario Zandstra: Well, thank you so much for letting me be part of it. Have a great day.

Jim: We'll be right back with more on iRetire4Him.

Break: Hey, listen. We would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement, head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement, retirementreformation/books.

That's retirementreformation.org/books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to, iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. Bruce, going back to your book of A Fruitful Retirement. I not to go on negative, but we talk all the time and how we can succeed and thrive and retirement, but sometimes we can blow it to in chapter seven, you describe blowing it in retirement. Give us some examples.

Bruce: Well, you know, during the decades of, let me just read part of this just right from the chapter. During the decades of work and the home improvement industry, Bob Bob had his heart set on a retirement dream. He modeling and expanding his own home review, spending more of his time since he was no longer had to spend most of the day at the office a few weeks after he, after he retired, the man I referred to called Bob the builder was putting plans into place for three major home projects. He did a man-cave and enclosed patio and remodeled garage. And we all have those kinds of themes of, you know, how the house is good, but it needs more, 16 months later, the projects were completed. The dust and disruption had settled and Bob beamed with pride about the improvements in his camp.

On the other hand, he and his wife, Linda now had nearly $100,000 less for their retirement years and they had the day quit working. Bob's building expenditures meant the couple had to adapt to a tighter budget than they had wanted leading Linda to reluctantly return to teaching in public school part-time. Well, the unintended consequences of very good deed. And so. They had great pride in, in, in those, in Bob, at his man cave. And they had an enclosed patio and they had a remodel garage, but they had to make adjustments. And so realizing that we don't think fully about the implications of what we're doing, the unintended consequences come back at us. And then we have to be able to, and willing to adapt how much better it would have been for Bob to have budgeted that some years before. So they had the a hundred thousand dollars set aside and it wouldn't reduce his retirement flexibility. Just an example.

Jim: How do we make sure we don't blow it? I mean, it's you go on, you give a lots of examples through a chapter seven of blowing it. How do we make sure we're not one of those statistics?

Bruce: Best way as to have a plan, as I said before, and I'll say it often, you know, you've got to start with what's true. And so if what's true is that you don't have enough, or if what's true is, you know, pick it you know, Bob's situation.

So you need to know what's true and you need to have a plan. Once you have a plan. What you're doing with that plan is you're anticipating what's coming ahead for you and, and you can make arrangements for that to be taken care of. It's kind of one of the reasons that we typically recommend that people pay off their.

So that in fact that is not a major cost issue, although insurance and everything else is going nuts, but, but that the, that the house is owned and that the value of its increase will be a buffer for you. And so planning ahead and doing it intentionally And, and is the best way to approach it.

Jim: And surrounding yourself with people for wise counsel, you got to sometimes the wise counsel thing here. I think you have that, that Solomon talks about awesome all the time. Often. I think it'd be really appropriate here to keep you from blowing it.

Bruce: Well, if I could say that the, one of the things we're looking forward to as the message of the Retirement Reformation expands is to be able to build communities of individuals.

Small groups. If you wish that in fact can meet together and share their accumulated knowledge and wisdom and screw ups and all the things that happen in life and that we can learn from each other because we learn best in community and is the easiest to learn from other people's mistakes, not yours.

Jim: It's the least painful, but often not used. Often we have to make our own. First, you're going to talk about it in the next chapter about the longevity premium. What's that, is that something I've got to pay on my taxes or something or what?

Bruce: Yeah. It's where I can send you a bill for it actually is the way it's going to go. But the longevity premium is the benefits that come from having more time.

To be able to address the issues and to be able to grow spiritually impact others and define that meaning and purpose. If your life is cut short, when we say, you know, someone, someone died and their life was cut short or really saying is they didn't have the opportunity to experience and to be able to share those experiences with others, to find meaning and purpose and that, that sense of loss.

And so the, the premium is to be able to grow personally. And to be able to experience community and be able to then be able to impact others. Like the lady that we talked to, where her knitting group ended up in the, in the in, in the seating area of a mall and they were able to impact. Another whole generation in a surprising way.

Jim: You say that six areas of our life will benefit from this longevity premium. Well, what are those six areas?

Bruce: Well, I tell you why just to make sure that I've got those, I better look them up to make sure that I don't forget them. Here we go. First one is wisdom. That means applied application of what it is that we have learned spiritual growth. Finding many and purpose, greater emotional maturity, contentment, and increased capacity for service and leadership, so increased capacity, but that really means is being available to be able to use the gifts and talents that you have to be able to impact the lives of others in those circumstances that you find yourself or that God puts.

Jim: And you've got that increased capacity because you're not working full-time anymore. And you've got that.

Bruce: That was one of the key things about increased capacity is, is to do that. I think the, one of the areas that, that I find in on that I talk about a lot is this whole idea of meaning and purpose and, and the reason why talk about it so much is because when you have meaning and purpose, it allows your past.

To provide energy and to provide perseverance and to provide access and to provide and ASM. And so if you're not working in your area of meaning and purpose, then in fact, you will be less than all that you can be.

Jim: You know, I find in that list, the list of these six areas of that'll benefit from your longevity, premium wisdom, spiritual growth, meaning and purpose, greater emotional maturity, contentment, increased capacity for service and leadership is contentment.

It seems like contentment as one of the things that Americans really need to work on. How do you see that playing out in your own life, Bruce? Contentment.

Bruce: Hey, contentment is the capacity to remain calm in the face of an emotional challenge. Contentment is the ability to see a solution to a problem that is difficult.

To me, contentment is the ability to respond gently to a conversation with Judy, for example, that perhaps in years past, I would have responded with emotion, not always positive, but that sense of contentment, another piece of contentment is, is another part of contentment is peace. That peace that God is in control.

I don't have to manage it all. All I have to do is represent him in the circumstance and to call upon all the great experiences that he's given and the grace and the DNA to be able to deal with it. So, so it's living a life of contentment. Isn't a life of not doing anything. It's a light, it's a life of being able to deal with the issues of life in a God honoring way, in a way that.

You'll remain peaceful. Therefore you remain powerful.

Jim: And Paul said it i n Philippians 4:11 through 13, you have to learn to be content first. Let's end the show today with you commenting on the age wave, the realization that we want to be more useful than youthful. What is this age wave thing all about?

Bruce: Our society, our culture - the value of youth has great value. It has energy. It has has health. It has curiosity. It has all of those things. And yet, as a result of that, in fact, as we age, we're able to use those experiences to be able to tell. Our understanding and our application of life to a different level. There are 10,000 people turning 65 in the United States, United States and Canada, every single day. Package that accumulated wisdom and apply it. We might have a chance for world peace. And so here is the ongoing of the greatest, the fastest growing age group percentage-wise in the country is 90 year olds on a percentage basis, not numbers, but on a percentage basis, they are growing the fastest. And so we have this reality of age and longevity and we either let it destroy or we take it as an opportunity to build the kingdom.

I vote for the latter.

Jim: Absolutely. Bruce, we've been talking all day long about segments excerpts from your latest book of fruitful retirement. How can people get a copy of this?

Bruce: Thank you. Have a copy of book at Amazon or any place that books are sold and you can also go to our website. Just retirementreformation.org.

Not only will you find this as a resource but there's lots of other resources there that are good. And so when we, when we realize that it's the fourth in a series, starting with finding freedom, then moving forward, then charting your course and finally A Fruitful Retirement.

Jim: Bruce great conversation today. You've been listening to, iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation with your host, Jim Brangenburg and Retirement Reformation's founder, Bruce Bruinsma . Check us out online retirementreformation.org. So many resources out there, Retirement Reformation.org, we're Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation.

So we can ultimately say iRetire4Him!

Outro: Thanks for listening to, iRetire4Him with your host, Jim and Martha Brangenburg. And Retirement Reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma. IRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement.

However, in your retirement. You can be focused on God's unique call to love, serve and help others. This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and money. And invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you.

The Retirement Reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life, especially in retirement. Take time to sign the manifesto at retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation.

So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirementreformation dot O R G.

4/25/22 - iRetire4Him Show 60: A Fruitful Retirement, Part 2

Intro: While retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self-focus God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The Retirement Reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in retirement to embrace the. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop, you can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation, so you can say, iRetire4Him.

Jim: Reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are fast approaching retirement or already in retirement. You've tuned in to iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg, along with the founder of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce Bruinsma, check us out online on our app in the app store, download Retirement Reformation in the apple podcast or in the apple app store or online on Facebook, Retirement Reformation on our website, RetirementReformation.org.

Christians are called to ministry for a lifetime. Impacting and changing lives is more than a priority; it's God's mandate to all of us, but what does that look like in retirement? The common call for all believers to minister, while impacting others and help to change lives, no matter where we are in life, then there's our unique goal, which is based on our unique set of gifts, talents, and abilities.

But how does all that play out in our retirement? Retirement is not only the reward for past service, with a little less stress, but also a stepping stone, a launching pad for future ministry, future fully funded ministry. As Bruce Bruinsma says - the founder of the Retirement Reformation just released his latest book in the future funded ministry series.

Book number four, A Fruitful Retirement is what it's called the result of a future funded ministry. Bruce joins us today for part two of a four part series, talking about how your retirement years can be A Fruitful Retirement. Bruce Bruinsma, welcome back to iRetire4Him.

Bruce: Thanks, Jim. Good to be here. And I remember when when you think about fruit, you think about what? If you're in a field of fruit, let's say it's a apple orchard. What you have to do is to, to really appreciate it. Enjoy. And to experience it. You got to go pick an apple, you got to take some action. And so being fruitful, isn't looking inward, it's reaching outward.

Jim: And I think it's taken that example even further, Bruce, if you're in an orchard or of any type, an apple orchard, an orange orchard, a grape vine orchard, whatever they call those. Sorry! They take decades to be fruitful to be really fruitful. And there's a lot of pruning involved and there's, and by the time the apple trees and orange trees are really fruitful.

And by the time grapevines are really fruitful, they're gnarly and they, they they're, they've seen some weather and they've seen some challenge and that's when they give you their best fruit. And that's really the great example of A Fruitful Retirement. These are the best years of our life. Aren't they Bruce?

Bruce: They are. And the you can take that example and continue to expand it. I think our audience will connect with that. And so just because you're going downhill somewhat physically or somewhat mentally does not mean that you're closer walk with God, your emotional growth that you have and maturity that you have in your understanding of, of life in its flow and process can more than outweigh any of those physical issues that you have to be able to bring you that meaning and purpose as you apply that and connect with others.

Jim: Yeah, Bruce, and in my book, iRetire4Him I said, this: listen as a retired person or chronologically superior person, and maybe you're not old enough to run the place anymore, but you're perfect age to be a coach.

And you could always, there's always time whether your legs work or your arms work or no. If your mind is working, you can pour your life into somebody else. Bruce, in chapter three of, of fruitful retirement, you say that a quarter or more of Americans who retire will go back to work. Why? Why is that?

Bruce: It's interesting. We're learning a lot about that for a while. For, for a long time, we really thought that the reason they went back to work was because. They haven't planned well enough financially. They had to go back in order to earn money. That was the common understanding. And while in some cases, that is absolutely true.

Or finding that in an increasingly large number of places that, that in fact, your work, where you worked or the work that you do is where your ministry takes place. Where are your relationships continue to flourish, where your opportunity to be encouraged and to work with others as part of a team that really is important to you happens.

And so we're seeing more and more people that are, that are going back to work because it's the environment where they feel the most fulfilled. All I can say to that is hooray and, and, and if that is the case, then go for it. The lack of... it's a wonderful time for people to consider that because there's jobs available everywhere of all different kinds.

Jim: All over the country.

Bruce: In every area it's impacted by that. So it's a wonderful time that if in fact that, you know, maybe, maybe it's three days a week, maybe it's two days a week, whatever it may be, that if in fact that's an area where. You can both minister, in other words, impact others' lives as well as be fulfilled yourself, nothing wrong with that.

Jim: Since most people retire because their work takes away their time and their energy and their freedom. How can people find work in their retirement years that builds in time and increases energy and lets them still feel the freedom while fulfilling their unique calling? Or how does that happen? How can they get that?

Bruce: No, it's interesting. It's an interesting human phenomenon, but when you let go, instead of losing control, you gain control.

And so when you have freedom to be able to respond to opportunities and needs, that freedom is, is priceless. Now if we go back and the way I read my Bible, it says we are always going to work. Work means putting out effort. So we're going to always be putting out effort. It's never going to be a time when we don't put out effort.

The question is, what are you, why are you putting out the effort? What are you putting out the effort for? And what is the result of the effort? If it is to lower your golf score, you're going to work hard. You're sweating. When you're coming off the 18th hole, you worked. You put effort and intentionality into what you're doing, that's leisure and that has value. But now can we find meaning because we're all going to work one way or another.

Jim: You know it's really important for us when we talk about the word work. When you look at the word work in Hebrew, which is written throughout the old Testament, isn't the word for work is also the same for worship and is also the same for service because God intended our work to be worship.

No matter what that work is. And when we look at it that way, all of a sudden things, that's a paradigm shifter. When you start to really look at that and I, my Hebrew's not great. I had somebody else tell me that and I studied it. But when you realize that, that the very essence of our work, which God gave to us before sin entered the world, it was all about worshiping him, bring glory, bringing glory to our heavenly father through our work.

I think that's a fantastic. First, one last question in this segment. You mentioned in A Fruitful Retirement, you say no two retirements are the same. Why, why is that important to understand?

Bruce: It's important to understand that. In fact, when we are looking for models to, to help us to understand what this retirement is all about, to realize that God made each one of us unique and special, each one of us is unique.

Therefore, ours are his plan for. The DNA that we're born with, the experiences that we have and the attitude to which we bring to these next stages are all going to be unique and different. And so it's when you are reaching out and impacting someone else's life, there may be the category of people that you can really relate to, and the help may be different than those of your spots.

And so to realize what's true, is that that's okay because we are all each unique, although created in God's image. Yeah.

Jim: One size does not fit all. And just because it's working for Bob to go down to work at home Depot doesn't mean it's for you. Maybe that you got to go work at five guys, which, you know, the food is pretty good.

Hi, you're listening to, iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. We'd love for you to check us out. Online retirementreformation.org. Go to our resources. Look up books and get yourself a copy of, a fruitful retirement. Of course you can also get it on Amazon. We'll be right back with the conversation with author Sharon Mondragon and about her book, The Unlikely Yarn of the Dragon Lady.

We'll be right back. Hang on.

Break: Hey listeners. We would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement. Head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement, retirementreformation.org/books. That's retirementreformation.org/books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. Every second segment, we always bring on a special guest to share a little bit of this. And this week I'm invited another author, an author, Sherry Mondragon. She wrote this book, The Unlikely Yarn of the Dragon Lady.

And you're like, Jim, we have a novel that we're going to highlight during the second segment? Hang on. You'll see why. Sherry welcome to iRetire4Him.

Sharon Mondragon: Well, thank you for having me. I'm delighted to be here.

Jim: So, so grateful to have you on. I loved your book, The Unlikely Yarn of the Dragon Lady. Why did you write this specific novel about a bunch of mostly retired ladies being kicked out of their comfort zone? Is there something personal in here?

Sharon Mondragon: The very first prayer shawl group that I belonged to was meeting in public, when this group of women went to the pastor and said, we'd really love to have a prayer shawl ministry. The pastor said, well, sure, you can do that, but you can't meet at the church. I want you to do your knitting in public.

And so that was my first experience. But. Also, I began to wonder: the women that I knitted with went willingly. They were happy to meet in public, but what if there was a group of women, women who weren't happy about the idea of what might happen?

Jim: Well, and you wrote an entire book about it. This is great. You use the pastor of a local church - a local church that was failing as a local church. It was struggling - to kick the knitting group out of the chapel. Use the excuse of, Hey, the chapel is going to go through some renovations. Why do you think it's so important that even a knitting group needs to get out of the church? Why did your pastor say not here? Take it out of here?

Sharon Mondragon: Well, I think that it's our pastor's job to challenge us, to take it out of here. At the end of every service that I go to, he says, go in peace to love and serve the Lord. So we are supposed to go out there and he is the one who supposed to commission us, nudge us, kick us to do it.

Jim: So when your knitters got kicked out of the chapel and the pastor said, go, go be out in the public. They started knitting in public at a coffee shop. What did they learn? What did they learn about themselves?

Sharon Mondragon: Well, they had thought that they were fairly invisible, especially when women get to a certain age, we tend to feel that way. But their very first time out a college student who was studying at the coffee shop, came over and wanted to know what they were doing.

And when she found out that they were praying, she asked them to pray about her anatomy test. People noticed when they sat there knitting. They weren't invisible.

Jim: Mm. So powerful. But then they got kicked out of the coffee shop and they decided just to go into the sitting area at the mall. What further transformation did they realize when they got out in public?

Sharon Mondragon: Well, they became visible to even more people. And to a very different demographic than what they had been involved with before, simply a church. The retail workers caught wind of the fact that, that they would pray for people that the college students spread the word because she passed her anatomy test and they would come every Wednesday morning to the sitting area.

And there would be a stack of paper napkins with prior requests. And they became aware of the needs of the young people who worked at the mall, the college students, the young people trying to make ends meet the young people, just trying to, to survive their jobs in retail. They got to know a whole different group of people.

Jim: And they saw the value they were to that community. That, I mean, they really saw it, it transformed those lives. And I love the fact that they're like, what are all these napkins on the table? Oh, my word they're prayer requests. It's so fantastic. Now the dragon lady in your story is a woman named Margaret.

She's kind of the overbearing annoying lady at church who's always causing trouble. And she was the leader of this knitting group self-imposed leader of this knitting. What did she learn about herself as she got kicked out of her comfort zone?

Sharon Mondragon: She learned that she wasn't as in control as she thought she was. And through the situations and the people that the group met at the mall, she became increasingly confronted with the root cause of her need to control. And she learned that God wanted her to do it a different way.

Jim: Hmm. And she did it. I mean, she was a retired quote, unquote, a retired lady. And she was a little stuck in her in her ways to say. I mean, if you know, Saturday night live and the church lady honestly describes Margaret inside your book pretty well. But she, she had a transformation, didn't she?

Sharon Mondragon: Yes, she did.

Jim: I know you don't want to give it away, but I want to give it away. I mean, this is fantastic. You need to read this story in order to understand the power of God in our lives when you get kicked out of our comfort zone. Sherri. So many of our listeners have relegated themselves in retirement to hanging out with people who look just like them and are in the same time of life, speak some encouragement to them.

What you learned yourself as your knitting community got kicked out of their comfort zone as well? What did our knitters learn about themselves and their value to the community and speak that same encouragement to our listeners today?

Sharon Mondragon: Well, I originally had written this because I felt like people of my age still have something to give, but it's not just that. It's not that we still have something to give it's that we have more to give than at any other time in our lives. We have love and compassion and wisdom that's been tempered and forged in the fires of life. We have time to listen, to offer friendship, to pray, to care to people of all ages. And we have a steadiness that has come because we've been through so much and God has been faithful.

Over the years, it's a calm and a steadiness that this world that's increasingly anxious needs. Especially the young people. I see far more anxiety in young people than I ever remember experiencing myself. But I also know that when I was the middle-aged mother of a couple of troubled teens, it was the Denisons of the early service at St. Christopher's church in Killeen, Texas, who took me under their wing, who listened, who prayed, who didn't bat an eyelash what I told them, my wild tales of parenting these boys. And they gave me courage to make the decisions that had to be made in order for the right things to happen. And I will be forever grateful to those people.

Jim: Shout out to the Denisons. Sherry, where can people get a copy of your book, The Unlikely Yarn fo the Dragon Lady? Where can they get a copy?

Sharon Mondragon: Well, it's available on Amazon, Barnes and noble, Christianbook.com. It comes in three forms, paperback, Kindle, and the audio book. The audio book is fantastic.

Jim: Do you read it or do you get a whole bunch of your kids to read it?

Sharon Mondragon: Oh, no, I didn't, I didn't read it. No,the incomparable christine Moore was the narrator for that and she did a fabulous job. There's chapter 23. I can't read it without crying, no matter how many times I've read it. So I was very glad to have a professional do it.

Jim: Sherry, it was so great to share your book. I enjoyed it thoroughly and I loved the life lesson that we just need. We need as older chronologically superior folks, we need to get out in the public. The young people desperately need access to us and yeah, they can learn knitting, but if they can learn knitting and prayer at the same time and some other practical stuff is so powerful. Thanks for sharing your book. And thanks for being on iRetire4Him today.

Sharon Mondragon: Thank you so much for having me. It was a joy.

Jim: I really appreciate it. We'll be right back with more on iRetire4Him.

Break: Hey. We would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement, head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement. Retirementreformation.org/books. That's retirementreformation.org/books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Himm, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce, we're talking about your book and the conversation about your book, A Fruitful Retirement, your, your latest one for us over the years. You've asked people, what do you want to do in retirement?

What's the one word answer that you get all the time?

Bruce: Here's the answer, Jim. Are you ready for the word? Nothing.

Jim: Nothing. All right. But since nothing's simply isn't enough to make life meaningful and fulfilling, what should retirees do?

Bruce: Something other than nothing.

Jim: Because nothing leads to where?

Bruce: Nowhere. Isn't that the way it works? But listen to this for just a minute. I think it's important. And we see in scripture where it says. Without, without Christ, I can do nothing. Now, just reverse that if I'm doing nothing that would suggest that my connectivity to Christ is marginal at best. And so when we think about retirement, what Christ has in mind for us, what God has in mind for us, not only to follow his principles in a universal way to love your neighbor and to spread the word, but to be able to bring your unique talents to needs that exist in the world and to be able to impact people's lives in, in, in each one of the different stages of retirement. And there are three of them to be able to do that. And so that idea of, of being satisfied with nothing leads to nowhere.

Jim: I mean, and look where it leads. I've lived in Florida for 20 years. I've lived in the retirement capital of the world and I see what happens when people live for nothing. They literally die. They have no purpose. Th they're bored. They move into neighborhoods where there's, you know, 55 pluses, no children allowed, no kids allowed. All right. They can only have little yepper dogs can't have big dogs, all kinds of rules, regulations.

You don't even get to mow your own cotton picking lawn or trim your own trees. You can't park outside. You can't wash your own car. I mean it's and they have no purpose. It's what they do. They watch TV all day long and they get bored to death. And that's not what God intended, is it Bruce?

Let's examine what happens in that kind of circumstance and lots of others is that. And because of longevity our world, if we allow it, our world continue to shrink and as our world continues to shrink, we focus on who ourselves. And as we focus on ourselves, that then becomes a downward spiral. Because there is no meaning and purpose.

There's only problems, pain and grouchiness. And so the critical element is to turn from things that look inward to activities that take us outward, where there are people. Now it's true that, you know, I was at a funeral on Saturday and I'm sure I'm going to a whole bunch more here in the next period of time.

So our world shrinks 'cause our friends die. That happens over a period of time. That's what's true. And so you need to be intentional about not replacing those friends, but finding new ones where in fact you're who you are, can be meaningful too and with them.

Bruce, when you see people pursue something and retirement pursue a life of adventure, whatever that adventure, just something more than nothing, use one word to describe their lives.

Bruce: Oh, fruitful.

Jim: I love it. Bruce, you're 81 years old. And you are the king of having purpose in your retirement years. I don't know anybody that has more purpose in the retirement years than you. Do ever think you'll learn to enjoy rest and relaxation and a little leisure here and there?

Well, one of the things I've learned is that I need, I need a little more sleep. So I go to bed a little bit earlier. And there is that there are some times when I think about the honey-dos around the house and I really need to get those done. And I say, yes, I do. But I think maybe tomorrow it will be okay if I really do it tomorrow.

So I give myself permission to be able to adapt and adjust. And, and to provide enough bandwidth so that in fact I'm healthy. I'm healthy in my relationships. I'm as healthy as I can be in my body. I'm healthy in my spiritual relationships. And so to give enough space to do that, and sometimes that means going on a cruise.

Sometimes that means like Judy and I are going to the Netherlands. 10 days on a special, very specialized tour. And we'll be exhausted when we're done, but it's going to be great to be able to make that change.

And that's, what's really been good for you though, is having Judy who is fully retired, quote unquote, right now, she's no longer working for a paycheck. She's very busy. I know, but she said honey I'd like to spend some time with you. Can we go do some fun things? And you've had to schedule in those fun things, so you don't get caught up in working and it's good to listen to your spouse.

Bruce: Absolutely. It's critical to listen and to intentionally say to yourself, you know, it's important that Judy and I spend time together. And so that I intentionally then, you know, it's important to her that I get home by six o'clock at night just left to me. It probably would never happen, but I've committed that it's important to her. It's important to our relationship. So I got to make sure that if I'm at the office and I'm out of here by five 30, so I can be home by 6.

And to be able to make commitments that will intentionally enhance in, in maintain your, your relationship. And so it's not something that just comes just because you woke up in the morning, that intentionality is really important.

Jim: Bruce, how can the Retirement Reformation help our listeners, our friends listening today, get them on a path towards a fruitful retirement?

Bruce: First of all to as long as they're listening, so they've got some interest in the subject. Secondly, take a book like yours or take a book like any one of the three books in the series that I've written or start with A Fruitful Retirement. Cause it will encourage you. It will encourage you. We'll give you some models that will give you some ideas about what to do.

So many people, they say, well, I'd like to do something more. I just don't know what to do. Well, let's find the beginnings of a path, my grandfather's words. And you've heard me use it before is once begun, is half done. And so let's agree that we are going to begin and then listening to the holy spirit, the opportunities that come. And understanding our own experience and what we're capable of doing to be able to begin to step into a new world,

Jim: A fruitful retirement, Bruce Bruinsma, great conversation today. Thanks for your book, a Fruitful Retirement. Listeners, you can get a copy on Amazon or on our website, RetirementReformation.org.

Thank you. You've been listening to, iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation, with your host, Jim Brangenberg. And of course the founder of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce Bruinsma. We're Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation. So we can ultimately say iRetire4Him!

Outro: Thanks for listening to iRetire4Him, with your host at, Jim and Martha Brangenberg and Retirement Reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma. IRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement.

However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to. Serve and help others. This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and money and invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you, the Retirement Reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life.

Especially in retirement. Take time to sign the manifesto at retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirement, reformation dot O R G.

4/11/22 - iRetire4Him Show 59: A Fruitful Retirement, Part 1

Intro: While retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self focus, God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The Retirement Reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in retirement to embrace the. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop, you can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation, so you can say, iRetire4Him.

Jim: Reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are approaching - are fast approaching retirement. We're so glad that you joined us today here on iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg, along with the founder of the Retirement Reformation, Bruce Bruinsma, check us out online, please., Retirementreformation.org, retirementreformation.org. And of course on Facebook, Retirement Reformation, or you could download our app Retirement Reformation in the apple podcasts. You know, Christians are called to ministry for a lifetime. Impacting and changing lives is more than a priority it's God's mandate to each of us.

This mandate, the call in our lives has two parts. The common call for all believers to minister, while impacting others to help and change lives. Then there is our unique call, which is based on our unique set of gifts, talents, and abilities. But how does all that play out in our. Retirement is not only a reward for past service, but also a stepping stone, a launching pad for future ministry, future fully funded ministry.

Bruce Bruinsma, the founder of the Retirement Reformation, just released his latest book in the future funded ministry series. And it's called A Fruitful Retirement: the result of a future funded ministry plan. Bruce joins us today for part one of a four-part series, talking about how your retirement years can be a fruitful return. Bruce Bruinsma, welcome back to iRetire4Him.

Bruce: Yeah, it's good to be with you. And to be able to dig into this topic for our next four sessions and to be able to find some encouragement for our listeners that that they're at those years, that that can be really fruitful,

Jim: Bruce, right off the bat, in your book, you quote Jonathan Burton from MarketWatch, when he says retirement ain't all it's cracked up to be. Many pre-retirees do not fully comprehend how dramatically their lives will change. Bruce, what have you seen? Is that statement really true?

Bruce: That statement is, I don't know if it can be more than true, but that's even, it's definitely true. And the, the expectation that we have. That the transition from a career to that next stage is going to be one of peace, tranquility, leisure, fun, no pressure less decisions. And so on that it won't be complex. That could not be further than the truth. As a matter of fact, the 30 years, and we talk about retirement and as a 30 year period, I really believe is the most complex time in the life. But because of other related growth opportunities that we have, it can also be the best 30 years of our life.

Jim: Absolutely. I mean, if you look at your retirement years, which you haven't really started the retirement years yet, but for the last 16 years of your quote unquote qualified retirement. Yeah. I don't know that you could have been any busier and God's been doing amazing things in your life.

You know, Bruce, that just reminds me, as people, prep for and get ready to retire, you say that many are suffering from retirement jitters. What are retirement jitters and why?

Bruce: Well, we get the quote unquote jitters when we are unsure of what is ahead or where you're unsure of what it is that we're walking into?

And so you're going to go you have an invitation to go to someone's home. You haven't met them before. You're going to meet some friends there and you're standing, you're walking up to that front door and you're kind of the butterflies in your stomach are not organized into a flight pattern. And so the jitters, if you wish, or the butterflies, and uncertainty about what's next.

Jim: Bruce, with so much doom and gloom in the news. First of all, I don't know why people even turn on the news anymore, but with so much doom and gloom in the news and the financial markets going up and down like a rollercoaster at Busch gardens and with inflation now skyrocketing, is it possible to be at peace with our coming retirement?

Bruce: It certainly is. And it's all based upon: do you have, do you understand what's true? Basic number two, do you have a plan on how you're going to deal with what's true? And third, do you have a relationship with Jesus and someone to talk to and be able to plug into the power of the holy spirit? Because one thing we know and we can be guaranteed is that in all of our lives, there's going to be change.

And this transition from career or from one of the other stages in retirement to If you don't have a plan, if you aren't connected to Jesus and if you don't know what's true, then having the jitters would be the natural expectation. And so you deal with it in those ways. It mean it's always going to be fun now.

Doesn't mean it's always going to be clear now, doesn't mean that it's a, that there's not going to be some confusion or, or new and strange things that you're faced with but as in all of our life that way. And so for it not to be that way, it would be really weird and strange. And so to know what's true and that's part of the heart of the Retirement Reformation.

And part of the reason why I wrote the fruitful book, the fourth book in that series was to encourage people and to help them come to grips with what's true. And then to help them to make a plan and then to be able to step into it. Now you have to read the third: Charting Your Course to really lay out that plan in a, in a meaningful way.

But the being fruitful is what God, God calls us to be. And if I can just add one more is that, you know, our verse is: you did not - Jesus speaking - you did not choose me, but I chose you. And I prepared you to be fruitful and to bear fruit that will last. So I think that's a promise we can count on.

Jim: But so many people, as you just said, you know, you've been a financial planner, a financial advisor for decades and decades, and a lot of people have done a financial plan. Very few people have had the opportunity to do like a course, like charting your course, and actually plan how they'll spend their time in retirement. But for those that are, have planned their financial future, they're all of a sudden they're going, yeah, but I didn't plan on another, a whole bunch of high inflation years in here and skyrocketing housing costs and things like that.

Bruce, how will A Fruitful Retirement, your latest book - and by the way, it's a very good book. I read a ton of books for all the shows that we do, and I absolutely loved it. How will reading A Fruitful Retirement helped me get there to that place of peace and purposefulness in my retirement years ?

Bruce: Well, first of all, it will help you deal with what is true and everything starts with that. Number one, what is true? Secondly, what is your goal? And when we have a goal of, if our, if our understanding of what it's true, and the goal that we have is, is carrying out God's plan for my life in this stage, then as I go through that process of understanding what it is and carrying it, each day when I approach that day, I'm going to be in peace about it, regardless of the conflict or the, or the changes that come around.

Hey, we've got inflation going crazy right now. I paid $4 and 89 cents for gas yesterday and filled up my tank. I mean, it's just a bummer. You take a look at the cost of electricity, cost of just about everything. So what is true is that we're going to be faced with a series of inflationary activities that are going to reduce the amount, the buying power of the money that we have.

That's true. Once we understand that's true, then we can take a look and we can say, all right, how do we need to adjust as a result of that? I have a very good friend that just decided they were going to sell their house, go to their smaller home, spend the summer there. And at the end of the summer, they'd look up and say, okay, what's next in our step.

That's a step that they decided to take. And there, there can be everything from reducing the number of times that you take your clothes to the laundry. You know, most people are totally surprised how much they spend doing that. As a matter of fact, I just calculated the other day: we spend about 250 bucks a month taken clothes to the, to the cleaners. Well, I can, I know that I can impact that by changing some of my behaviors.

Jim: You could do your own laundry, I guess you could learn how to iron even, and starch your own shirts. We're talking to Bruce Bruinsma about his latest book A Fruitful Retirement. We're going to take a break, check us out online retirementreformation.org, retirementreformation.org. Stay tuned. And our second segment time was Cynthia Ruchti who wrote a book Spouse in the House. Well, what happened when her husband retired and was home all day long? We'll be right back.

Break: Hey listeners, we would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement, head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement, Retirement Reformation.org/books. That's retirementreformation.org/books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the Retirement Reformation. As we do in every second segment of our show, we bring on somebody special to share a little bit of their story. And Bruce, it's my turn. I get to bring on the guest today. So you get to sit back and relax today. We're talking with Cynthia Ruchti. She is a - Cynthia, how many books have you written?

Cynthia Ruchti: I think it's 35, 36. Now, something like that.

Jim: And I've only read about half of those books, but one of the books that you've just recently released is Spouse in the House, and it's not a novel, I've read so many of your novels. This one is all about, well, I'm going to let you tell people. You and your friend, Becky Melby released this book together. You wrote it together because both of you are struggling with this new syndrome with your husband being home all the time. This is more of like a documentary of how you're dealing with it. What's the book all about? Tell, tell us about it.

Cynthia Ruchti: I love that you called into documentary. It's like, it's not a day in the life. It's like a life in the life and there's this period of time for, for a lot of us, which is when we come to the retirement age. But then the last couple of years it's happened to a wide segment of society where we find ourselves in tight spaces.

All together all the time, 24 7, it was originally spurred from the idea that not only were Becky and I dealing with that ourselves, but every time we would mention to, or overhear someone say he's home all the time, we would get the sea of nodding heads of women who understand. These are people they love. We love our husbands.

That's a given from the beginning and this isn't a book for marriages that are falling apart. That's another whole book. This is for marriages that are good, but all of a sudden, there's this tension because. He's home all the time. So the subtitle of the book Spouse in the House is: rearranging our attitudes to make room for one another.

Jim: Yeah. All right. So you're still working, you're still writing and honestly, people need to check you out on your own online. Do you have your own website? CynthiaRuchti.com? Okay. CynthiaRuchti.com, R U C H T I Cynthia Ruchti. You're still working, but wonder hubby got laid off and it turned into retirement that made you a member of the H H A T T club. And what does that stand for? And what's the struggle here?

Cynthia Ruchti: So he's home all the time is the hat club or the H H A T T. But we've switched that a little now, especially as Becky and I were writing this story. W H a T T, which is kind of what now what you do now, that this is the reality in our lives, because it's really we're home all the time. For me, I work from home. So even though I'm working and put in plenty of hours on what it is I do and love, now, my husband is home all the time. He does technically work a couple of days a week, but he has - they have a lot of Monday holidays, and he only works Mondays and Thursdays. So funny how many holidays fall on a Monday that he's home anyway those days, but the crisis comes - if you want to call it that - a lot of people realize that when you're expecting retirement to be this glorious blissful, we have all the time in the world now for one another, it's going to be just like when we were newlyweds.

We often hear, how do we prepare financially for retirement? We don't often hear how do we prepare our relationship for what's going to change? Even in our houses in retirement, we're bumping into each other. We're taking the last sandwich for our own lunch and it was supposed to be for supper going to be part of the supper meal, almost like having a bad college roommate sometime.

How do we navigate all that with a sense of humor, biblically, and then also in a way that is going to proactively make our relationships stronger instead of creating distance within that space of being home all the time?

Jim: The beauty of this is 20 years from now, we're going to be able to change this book and have a addition to she's home all the time, because there are a lot of guys working from home today, and we're gonna be able flip this on it because honestly, you know,I'm a guy. And I bet you're a little tough on wonder hubby. I thought it was tough. You know, I just thought you're a little tough on him.

Cynthia Ruchti: Then the book worked.

Jim: Yeah. Martha, she just, you know: what's the deal?? Okay. Is the solution that Bill just needed purpose in his life? Is that what was causing so much of the friction? So it hasn't helped that he gets out? I mean, tell us, I mean, being home all the time, what was driving you the most crazy?

Cynthia Ruchti: Okay. So our theory is that it happens all through marriage, but it's especially heightened in years of retirement. Few wives and husbands have exactly the same personality. If they do, not, not much of an interesting relationship. And so almost everybody who retires, there are differences in personality.

One wants quiet. One likes to have noise and activity around. One wants the grandchildren over every minute of every day. The other one enjoys them periodically. The one wants to be able to not have an agenda for their day. Bill is one of those people. I will ask him at breakfast. So what's on your, what's on the docket for you today? And I stopped asking the question because he never had an answer for me because he wanted to not have an assigned day. He wanted his retirement to be where he could decide as he goes along. And I'm a different kind of personality I thought yesterday about what was so exciting about today. And so we had to realize that what was different, where the tension was coming was because we're different human beings.

When God made us one flesh, he still gave us our own fingernails, our own hair follicles. Some of us. Yes.

Jim: Wow. And wow.

Cynthia Ruchti: I know, I see how I work that in. I didn't even plan that.

Jim: Yes, you did. You're such a cheese head. I'm throwing that right in. Right. That was just a mean, that was a mean anti Minnesota common right there. I just could feel it.

Cynthia Ruchti: There you go. But, but the joy of it is that it is, there is a, a natural opportunity for tension and there's a supernatural or godly opportunity for easing that tension.

Jim: Okay. It's been a couple of years though, since Bill got laid off and he's retired. Are things better? Have you guys found a rhythm?

Cynthia Ruchti: They were never awful. And that was the good thing

Jim: When I read this. I'm thinking you are getting really sick and tired of him being in the house...

Cynthia Ruchti: The joy of all of this is that there were some of those things that we just had to reintroduce the humor into the way we were looking at what was happening to us.

One real key element was that we felt that emotionally, we were tripping over each other. And, and oftentimes if a. Is dancing for instance, and they're stepping on each other's toes all the time that does not make for anything pretty. And it's going to be an unpleasant experience. So that can happen relationally and emotionally in a house too.

In our house, we had a very narrow walkway that we had lived with for decades in our home. There was a chimney in the middle of the house. The main walkway was 18 inches wide one day, rather than our colliding. Like we usually do. Yeah, my husband, who was used to saying, excuse me, added a little endearment and said, excuse me, my love. And that turned that pinch point into something that was precious to us, as opposed to being...

Jim: Just got a little R rated right here on iRetire4Him. Thank you, Cynthia, for that.

Cynthia Ruchti: My love? That's too much for you?

Jim: So I want you to speak, I want you to speak to the husbands who are finding themselves at home for the very first time on how they can take your book Spouse in the House, take this as a learning tool after they go get a copy. But speak to them. Speak a word of encouragement. Just a short word.

Cynthia Ruchti: It's not going to be automatic. If you expect that coming into retirement is going to all the little awkwardness is going to iron itself out automatically magically, that's not going to happen. We need to talk to one another. We need to realize that there are probably going to be pinch points. How are we going to deal with them? Whether that's financially or, what's our date night gonna look like now? Or when would you like to eat breakfast now that you have an option?

All of those things are going to have to be keeping that communication going, and then assuming for both men and women, that your partner isn't wrong, just different in the ways they want to maybe experience what the retirement years are like.

Jim: So then flip that on its head and speak to the ladies out there who are going through this H H A T T the hat club, they're just a new members into the hat club. They haven't had a chance to read Spouse in the House yet. Speak to those ladies.

Cynthia Ruchti: One of the things that made such a difference for me was coming to realize - I don't know how many years ago it was, but I had to come to realize that my husband wasn't just my husband and life mate, but he was my brother in Christ.

So everything in God's word that applies to relationships regarding kindness and courtesy and, and thinking the best of one another, all those things that they, God had put in his word already applied to this, applied to the marriage relationship. And forth. So for women, the, the encouragement would be, you think God has said anything about this subject?

Oh yes, he has. And so going back to that source of, we always go do, going back to his word is the place where we're going to find the tools we need. In addition to this book, in order to help navigate those waters and have it be the best it can be and, and really fulfilling years.

Jim: Spouse in the House is something everybody needs in their arsenal of books of looking at life has life changes as we enter our retirement year, Cynthia Ruchti, where's the best place for people to get a copy of your latest book Spouse in the House?

Cynthia Ruchti: Wherever books are sold, or they can also go to my website if they can't remember the exact lineup of letters for the word for the last name Ruchti, which is impossible .Cynthia Ruchti. They can also get to that same website through hemmed in hope.com. My tagline for this and marriage and everything in life is I can't unravel I'm hemmed in hope.

Jim: And we'll have a copy, a link to Cynthia's website right here in the show notes. Attached to the podcast. Spouse in the House. Get a copy. Cynthia Ruchti - thank you so much for being on iRetire4Him today.

Cynthia Ruchti: Thank you so much, Bruce and Jim.

Jim: We'll be right back with more on iRetire4Him.

Bruce: Hey listeners, we would love for you to get a copy of Bruce's latest book, A Fruitful Retirement. Head out to retirementreformation.org/books. You will find all of the books in the future funded ministry series there, including A Fruitful Retirement. Retirementreformation.org/ Books. That's retirement, reformation.org forward slash books.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Cynthia Ruchti about her book Spouse in the House.

Bruce, we're talking about your latest book A Fruitful Retirement. You know, you open up chapter two saying that people can be fully alive in the sixties, they're in their sixties and their seventies and their eighties, and even their nineties today, where just a century ago, the life expectancy was a mere 58 years old. How does this longevity revolution impact our ability to have A Fruitful Retirement?

Bruce: You know, if, if you just kind of think back of, of anything that you didn't know how to do. And then you met a friend and they knew how to do it. And they kind of mentored you in over a period of time. You became as skilled as they were in what it is that, that you were doing.

You, you learned it. And so the, the benefit, one of the benefits of longevity is that we have a time where we can learn how to live in these senior year. We can learn by the books. You can buy books I've written and others, you can learn by listening to our podcast and experiencing that you can observe what others do.

And so the longevity gives us an opportunity to learn and then to be able to apply those lessons in our lives. And if we learn and apply them and listen to what God is saying to us, in fact, we can have a joyful period. That is evidenced by the freedom that we have and what it in the, in what it is that we've learned in those prior years.

Jim: Yeah. It's funny. Bruce's a lot of, a lot of how we learn about life is from our parents, but most of us didn't have parents that lived to be... well, I did. I'm a little bit younger, but my parents didn't have parents that lived to be 60, 70, 80, 90 years old. And their parents didn't. So it's not like the people that are retired today, have a lot of people they can look to for what does it look like to live, to be 70, 80, 90, or even a hundred?

I mean, there's a huge growing wave of people over a hundred years old, Betty White, she lived to be 99 and you know, 10 months or something like that was, I mean, come on. I mean, imagine what she saw.

Bruce: So, you know, that's, that's the reason why there is the need for the Retirement Reformation and these dialogues that we are having together. And, and to be able to learn from each other, because we don't have a lot of models because there isn't a lot of experience. And when there isn't, then it makes the, the, those who have the experience and are able and willing to share it that much more valuable to be able to, as we talked about in the prior. So, to be able to understand what's coming and what's true.

Jim: Okay. So how does, knowing that we're going to live long lives in decades in our retirement - how does that impact our ability to make a difference and to live with purpose during our fully funded ministry, years of retirement? I think it, I think you say it best when you ask what are you gonna do with all those years?

Bruce: Those are the, that is the question in the, in the first division, in that, in the, in the answering that question comes from, are you going to continue to buy into what culture says retirement is, or are you going to buy into as best we can interpret what God intends for us and to be able to have an opportunity to really find meaning and purpose the difference between what culture says and what the Bible says? And what Retirement Reformation is, messaging is in fact, the difference between a meaning and purpose and leisure. And that's where the first decision gets made. Am I going to be dedicated to leisure? Am I going to be dedicated to meaning and purpose and have some leisure in the midst of it?

That's not unimportant. It's like taking a vacation. Is that important? Yeah. You bet. But finding meaning and purpose, which will bring you joy and freedom in all those different stages is that's that first decision about what are you going to follow is really critical.

Jim: What I love best in your book, as you did a great job, just finding lots of examples of, of people and you covered Randall Cunningham a football player, and you say Randall Cunningham is struggling and suffering from a disease we call unretirement. Actually I added that word. You didn't call it a disease, but you called it unretirement that he's had several bouts of unretirement, which I said, it's like a disease. Explain this to me. These bouts of unretirement.

Bruce: Well, we have a classic example, staying with a football area of, of Tom Brady who went through this whole big deal about retiring a few months ago. And now he is unretiring.

Jim: I hadn't heard that yet. I mean, it was, he was retiring from the Tampa bay Buccaneers. Did he go back? I hadn't heard that. Breaking news right here on iRetire4Him!

Bruce: All right. So, you know, one of the things that happens when we, when we learn something, is that when we learn it or discover it then, and we are taking steps that will be out of pattern with that understanding, sometimes we got to back up and rechange and go again, and there's nothing wrong with that.

I've got a couple of friends who in their retirement bought into the message that they wanted to find some meaning and purpose. It took some steps into some different areas, and finally they weren't the right ones. So they went back to the couch for a little while and they said, well, I think a better give it another go. And so they started down another direction, something happened and that didn't work out well. They went back to the couch and said, you know, I think I better give it another go. So perseverance is one of those keys that's important.

So they, then the third attempt, and in that third attempt, man, they found a thing that they're passionate about and that, you know, when their feet hit the floor in the morning, when the alarm clock goes off or they wake up that's what they're thinking about and they're ready to go. And so, but it, it takes some exploration, and it takes, perhaps some things that you're going to try and then back off from, or things you're going to try and call it failure if you wish, but, but it's not working out. And that's okay.

Jim: My mom was a teacher. In her late fifties after she retired, she went back and got her master's degree in Christian counseling and did Christian counseling for another 25 years and just loved it.

There's so many opportunities out there. I mean, it's just really important that we just tell everybody life is not over. When you retire, the, the horizons are unlimited where you can go, what you can do. So when people struggle with these bouts of unretirement, who do you think is living a more fruitful retirement, Randall Cunningham, or someone sitting at home watching movies, drinking, iced tea, and playing pickleball?

Bruce: Clearly, literally Randall Cunningham because he persevered that. I know that there is, you know, this calling now. It is even possible that just like in a, in a career, you don't stay necessarily with the same company for 30 years. You may, but you may have, you may change jobs every three, four or five years.

Well, why is it going to be any different in circumstances? Maybe the some difference, but why isn't that the same kind of an idea that during retirement? Sometimes I'm going to find something I'm passionate about it. I'm going to do it till the very end. Sometimes it's going to be for a period and then there's going to be another option. Give yourself the freedom to change, to make choices. To experiment.

Jim: Hmm. Great advice, Bruce. Where can people get a copy of your latest book, A Fruitful Retirement?

Bruce: Well, you can go to amazon.com and, and pick it up from Amazon. That's easy or you can go to our website and the website is retirementreformation.org. So there's a couple of places that you can get it. And hopefully it will be helpful to you, as I say, in the. You know, you might want to read the first three first, but if you start only with one, this is a good one to start with.

Jim: I would agree. They're all fantastic. And just a great layup for retirement, prepping for retirement or being in retirement or resetting in retirement, or unretiring in retirement. Bruce Bruinsma, thanks for being today with us on, iRetire4Him and for introducing your latest book A Fruitful Retirement.

Bruce: Well, I'm glad that we can be fruitful together.

Jim: Yeah. You've been listening to IRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation with your hosts, Jim Brangenberg and Retirement Reformations founder, Bruce Bruinsma. We're Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation, so we can ultimately say iRetire4Him,

Outro: Thanks for listening to iRetire4Him with your host, Jim and Martha Brangenberg. And Retirement Reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma. IRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the Retirement Reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement.

However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to love, serve and help others. This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience. And combine it with a greater freedom of time and money and invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you.

The Retirement Reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life. Especially in retirement. Take time to sign the manifesto at retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation.

So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirement, reformation dot O R G.

3/28/22 - iRetire4Him Show 58: Going Back to Work

Intro: Well, retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self-focus God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The retirement reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in return. To embrace the calling. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop. You can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the retirement reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation.

So you can say, I retire for him

Jim: reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are approaching or already into retirement. You're our special people you've tuned into. iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece of the retirement reformation. You've got Bruce, Bruinsma been here, the founder of the retirement reformation, and I'm Jim Brangenberg, the host of the show.

We'd love for you to check us out. Online retirement, reformation.org, retirement, reformation dot R. So much stuff out there. So many resources, so many connections to help you figure out how you can live out your retirement with intentionality, Bruce, let's face it retirement as laid out in the American dream is just a plain and simple, boring.

How in the world can you spend 30 years watching TV, building puzzles, playing golf and tennis, going, shopping, and going on vacation. There's got to be more to life than just entertainment and pleasure. So many of you listening today have figured this out. You're thinking. I just want to go back to work today and iRetire4Him, Bruce and I are going to talk about what does it look like when we go back to work as a retiree?

How can we build out retirement reformation intentionality while going back to work? Whether we're going back to work for pay or as a volunteer? This discussion is based on chapter six in the book iRetire4Him found online. I worked for him.com forward slash bookstore, Bruce Bruinsma. But welcome back to I retired.

Bruce: Well, this, this last topic that we're going to cover is one that is really near and dear to my heart, because I just, I see so many people that at the place where they were the happiest, most effective witness, um, both received and gave the most was in their work. Now we often think that people are still working in those during those retirement years, during those senior years is because they didn't plan very well and they need the money.

And that may very well be the case for many, but I think there are also many who, and in, in the numbers that we see in the, in the news and everything, to the number of people that have retired because of COVID, there's X percentage of those. And I, I suspect it's a, a larger number than what we think. Who?

Yes, they retired, but they, they really miss the work environment. And they'd like to come back to it, whether it be the same place, but in, in some other environment, as a volunteer or as you say, get paid, but be able to come back. Cause that's where they find meaning and purpose and able to be a witness.

And so this whole idea of working. Uh, faith and work is continuing to evolve and, and taking on a different context for us. And so that's why within the context of what, what you wrote in some of the great lessons you have here for us are really important,

Jim: Bruce, since you've never stopped working this isn't really a discussion you can even have in your own mind because you've never stopped, although I'm sure you and Judy have talked about it.

Why haven't you ever stopped working? I mean, you never retired and then started working again. You just got.

Bruce: Well, the, we so firmly believe and have embraced the reformation of our mind that God has a call on our lives and that call continues to evolve. Sometimes there's a transition period between one part of the call and the next, and sometimes it's just taking the next step and in my particular life so far through age 80 plus, uh, it has been taking the next.

There's not a right or wrong with any of that. But when people say to me, you know, when are you going to retire? My, my somewhat glib answer is this. I already am. I'm doing what God wants me to do, where he wants me to do it with whom he wants me to do. And that's the best definition of retirement that I can find.

And if we could embrace that as a community and understand that part of that may very well be within the work environment.

Jim: That's an important insight that I missed one other part, and you're having a ball. You have a lot of fun with what you're doing. Yeah. So let's talk, let's focus this segment on those that want to go back to work, but as a volunteer, because.

So people don't need the money, but they really want to go do something. I think there's some things that people should consider, though. If they're going to go back to work as a volunteer and I'm going to get your perspective, but I want to share my perspective first, because as a volunteer, you go back into, you're gonna be subject to somebody.

But I recommend that you find a organization to volunteer with, whether it's a business, you could volunteer at a business. There's a lot, a lot of small business owners all over America that would love to have a volunteer employee. That's got your knowledge.

Bruce: Who's no question. Okay. If I can, if I can just interrupt that for a moment.

I saw a bid on some, some TV station the other day, where in fact there was a small business. And with COVID and all the challenges, they didn't have the adequate staff and they were going to have to go out of business. And as matter of fact, people have been, their customers realize that was true and five or six of them came and volunteered to be able to mop the floor.

One of them to be a short order cook one of them to be a waitress, one

of them to be agreed.

And they volunteered themselves because they, they felt that the, the value of that business to their community was so great. They wanted to be part of that. I just thought that was outstanding.

Jim: And that's the point behind volunteering.

You want to volunteer somewhere that you want to be, and with people that you want to be. And so my challenge to everybody listening is find an organization that you're passionate about. Maybe you had a job that you love, but you don't want to go. But there's a small business down the road that might need you.

Or maybe it's a nonprofit, that's got a mission that you're like, I want to help them succeed. I got a couple of recommendations. I want to make sure that you, before you plant yourself into an organization, check out their culture. Maybe you worked in a culture getting paid and it wasn't so pleasant. Well, there's plenty of unpleasant cultures out there.

There's no reason as a volunteer. You need to be involved in one of them. Choose your culture. Why. That's one thing, one of the things you think Bruce, that people should consider when they're choosing where to volunteer,

Bruce: let me go back to that culture. Let me a friend of mine gave me this phrase the other day and then reflecting on it.

I think it's exactly right. Culture trumps almost everything. Culture trumps almost everything. As a matter of fact, here, when we're thinking of hiring someone, it's a two-step process. First we stepped into and make sure that they understand our culture and that there is a, they are a fit for us. That's before we look at technical skill or ability or anything else.

So culture trumps just about everything so that that's so wise.

Jim: And my other recommendation is to plant yourself in an organization. That's got young people, as we've talked about in previous pod. You're there to mentor. Yes. You're there to accomplish something, to do a task of some sort or whatever it may be, or to manage people, but make sure you plant yourself inside of an organization that has young people, that you can pour your life into.

That's that's the game here. You get a chance to occupy your time and invest Jesus and other people through you. What do think about that, Bruce?

Bruce: Well, I think that's critically important. The matter of fact, in your book, in this particular channel, You talk about five steps of things that can be done, uh, while you are in that work environment or in that volunteer environment that will.

Uh, bring additional meaning and purpose and values.

Jim: So when we come back in segment three, let's talk about those five steps because we've got an incredible interview coming up with L D Dr. LD, Buckingham. We want to hear from him and we'll come back at seven three. We'll talk about those five steps. All right.

Sounds like a plan. Listen, and I retired for him. We'll be right back.

Break: Membership has its privileges and where the retirement reformation. It's true. We have three levels of membership to access our growing wealth of resources. We also provide discipleship and training to bring the retirement reformation alive in your life.

So join us, go to retirement, reformation.org and click on the membership tab. Choose the level of membership that will help you rethink retool, reframe and reform your retirement today. The basic level is free so you can get started today. Take the journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say iRetire4Him.

Retirement, reformation dot O R G. Let's get back to more. I retire for

him.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to, iRetire4Him, Bruce, as we always do in the second segment of every podcast, you bring it on a special guest in order to just hear what they're doing and their retirement. Bruce, who do you have for us today?

LD Buckingham: Well, today we have Dr. Buckingham and we have reached. In this conversation up into, uh, up into Canada. And, uh, I was introduced to Dr. Buckingham and a little bit of his history through an associate of mine here, Elliot Inness. And so Dr. Buckingham, welcome to the podcast.

Bruce: Give us just a brief overview of how God has led you to this stage of your.

LD Buckingham: Oh, I pastored the same church for 45 years. Took a little time, the church, 65 people and solid grow around a couple of thousand, which is huge for this part of the world. For many parts of the world is really not that big a deal. And, uh, I'm enjoying this stage of life. Uh, in every way you could possibly enjoy it until the fullest.

Uh, people will talk to me about this stage of life. And I say, look, this is not so bad. The kids are gone. The bills are paid and the dog is dead.

I never felt better in my life. I'm 82 years old. Never felt better in every way that you can feel good mentally, physically, and every other way. But I'll tell you what it's all to do with purpose. And I have people saying to me all the time, high enjoying retirement. Well, my answer is the best way to enjoy your retirement is not the right time.

Because life is not about pleasure. Life is about purpose. And when you have a purpose that you have a passion for, that is your pleasure. So I'm the happiest guy in the face of the earth because of my.

Bruce: Well, you know, between your forehead and mine, we can, uh, we can represent, uh, uh, the fact and Jim's, as a matter of fact, you know, I, I always get a little bit concerned when, when I, when I'm reading in scripture and that, you know, God knows every hair on your head and, and, uh, I'm thinking guy, he must be in a bit of a confusion right at the moment, but then he's never confused, but we know that, uh, that, that the term retirement is not in the.

And that, uh, having

meaning and purpose. Matter of fact, we say in the retirement reformation

that we are called to be faithful for a lifetime and that lifetime isn't over until it's over. And then we began very lifetime for eternity. So what are some of the kinds of things that you're doing now that, that when you put your feet on the floor in the morning and you think about the day, uh, that that encourages.

LD Buckingham: Well, I, I would say this to give a little bit of background a leader, as you know, it's got to be a learner. And the truth of matter is I have come to realize I've got to be working harder at learning today and have a greater curiosity today than ever before in my life, because I've got to unlearn a lot of things that no longer work in today's culture and read, learn what connection with the culture speaks, the language of the culture.

And one of my highest values is change. And I know that's not often the case with people, my stage of life, but I value change because of what change can produce as long as change, without compromise of the main message that needs to be propagated. And so. And so I am fully involved and engage in what's called the Buckingham leadership Institute, which is mentoring pastors, leadership conferences, church consultations, helping churches go on to the next level and doing all that I can in relation to all of that.

Bruce: When we, when we, when we connect with people who have, have gone through the transition from that first, what we'll call Korea. Into the second, which we second calling, uh, that, that transition

period is, is really for many people, a very hard one,

one that they're really, they really not connected that God really has a plan for the rest of their life.

Did you have any challenges when you went through, when you stepped out of the pulpit after those 45 years and into yeah,

LD Buckingham: I was tired and I didn't know as tired because I evolved into being tired. So I took up. And just did nothing. And some people would say, well, how you doing? I say, look, if I was doing anything to last, I'd be dead.

Y'all know, but that was all I needed was on month. That would do me a lifetime. And, uh, and, and so, uh, wanted to get back into it because of the fire that was burning, the vision that was burning the cause that was so important to me, my calling really, which was a, was a major factor, but here's an interesting thing.

I got reflecting on this whole. After retirement age, I'm talking after retirement age, I was still pastoring the church. We saw more house. After retirement age on all the years prior to retirement, I mean, we S we built a 2000 seat auditorium with a 1500, uh, space atrium and saw more baptisms, more lives, transformed, saw greater growth, and all that is important to seeing things go forward.

And so there's something to be said. I think for the experience, as long as we are innovative, we are creating. We are open to change and, and then, uh, we can be, uh, I think continue to be just as effective in fact, There's some ways that I can be more effective today than ever before, because I am speaking to churches that have missed generation after generation.

So you've got a lot of older people and I talked the way a 30 year old talks about a lot of stuff and they kind of have to take it from me. They look at the third year old, so he's wet behind the ears. He doesn't know what he's talking about, but they can't. And I say to them, You know what I'm talking about here.

It could be, even though you may not necessarily be all that excited, but it could be the greatest thing since sliced bread. And the truth of matter is I was truly around when they first started slicing bread. And that was a big deal. I mean, people went preserved. They were so excited about sliced bread.

Now I know it doesn't mean a whole lot to us now because we're used to it, but. Innovative and change can be the most exciting thing that can help people to have expectation anticipation and an energy you know, about going forward.

Bruce: No, it's definitely it's, it's the it's it's the energy comes from a passion and the passion comes from purpose

and purpose or meaning.

And when you pile those together, it definitely can be the most. One of the things that is, is really tragic and, and that you and I, uh, No need to continue to pray for and speak into is that there's in between

Canada and the U S there's probably around 40, 45 million Christ followers who are 65 and older,

and about

85% of them based upon our surveys.

When we ask them, what are you going to do in retirement? Come up

with some version of. And they're trying to make meaning out of leisure. Now leisure has some value, but it does not have meaning. And then we also know that loneliness is leading to all kinds of, of negative reactions of people. These age, speak into that for just a moment, if you would.

LD Buckingham: Hi. I heard about a guy that was fully retired and his wife said to him, uh, what are you gonna, what are you going to be doing? What are you doing? You said nothing. She said, that's what you did today, ACL, but I'm not finished yet. That doesn't have much. I can't get that excited about nothing, you know? And, and, uh, I think that everybody, even if you've had a dull, terrible job, you can find something to do that can, you can have a passion for, it may not be in relation to whatever job you have.

And I, and I knew before I finished at the church, I was going to need to continue to fulfill my call with every thing I could put into it. And, and I'm telling you, there's just no way under the sun, that things could be, uh, more fulfilling by doing nothing. It, this, I quit that, that that's no life Ms. Will be dead

Bruce: when you're, when you're doing nothing.

You are, your focus is inward upon yourself. And when we focus on ourselves, that's not where we find meaning

and purpose. God's calling us to love our neighbor. God's calling us to extend the capacities that he's given us to address the issues of the, of the poor and the widows and all of the scripture that, that lays that out for us.

Um, I think there's a picture there for us, but that we often miss. And so being a messenger of that picture is, is something that you're doing well. And we appreciate.

LD Buckingham: You probably focused on this a lot, but one of my greatest heroes in the Bible is old Caleb, and I just love his spirit. I am as well I'm today when it was 85 years old as I was 45 years ago.

And so as you look at Caleb, it really is so interesting. He had a faith that no matter how old he got did not waver, he had a strength, no matter how old he got the did not weak. And then he had a blessing for others that didn't get wasted.

Bruce: And to me, that is one great example for all doctor, I'm going to close our conversation with that great summary.

As a matter of fact, uh, what I'm committed to doing is I will memorize. The first two times I use it. I will give you credit the third it's mine, just so that you know,

LD Buckingham: well, let me tell you this, the guy that I stole it from didn't seem to mind.

Bruce: Well, God bless you. I'm so, so thankful that we've had an opportunity to meet and we look forward to, uh, to meeting again and, and being able to partner together in making a difference for those who can make a difference.

Jim: Dr. LD, Buckingham. Thanks for being an iRetire4Him today. We'll be right back with more conversation with Bruce and I talking about, iRetire4Him. We'll be right back. Every iRetire4Him. She'll go so quickly. We don't often get to remind you that there are two resources you should be checking out right now.

I recommend that you get a copy of the retirement reformation book and the, iRetire4Him. Book retirement reformation focuses on the mindset and behavioral changes needs. Well, let's just say paradigm shifting that is needed to live out your faith in retirement. iRetire4Him is focused on many of the ways you can put your faith into action by investing your life into others in your retirement years.

Get both@theretirementreformationwebsiteinthebookstoreretirementreformation.org. That's retirement, reformation.org. Hey, welcome back to I retire from great conversation with LD Buckingham here in his story, Bruce, right before at the end of segment one, we talked about these five steps that I wrote about, and iRetire4Him and it really intrigued you.

You liked these steps, so let's, let's talk about the five steps we should consider as we go to volunteer or even go back to work, to get paid in an.

Bruce: Yeah. When I came across this, in your book and that chapter, they got big highlights on each one of those five. Cause I thought they were so relevant. And so insightful.

The first one was just simply kind of like, go get to know the people you work alongside and you got to you think, well of course that you're going to do that. Well, no, you can do that intentionally to learn about who they are, not just what they do. So that was the first. The second one. And then we can talk about these, but look for ways to serve those around you in a way that your job description doesn't require you to do wow.

Does that open up all kinds of ideas of ways to be able to mentor and the conversation that we're having to serve and to demonstrate a, both a humble and a selfless attitude towards what you're doing, that it's not about you. It's about what are the needs of those that are around you? So I just thought that was, that was just so God honoring and I'll just hit the third and then you, and I can talk about it, but spend some time together outside of the work environment, away from the pressures of work, most people need to have lunch.

And I've found that what a wonderful way, just to say somebody, Hey, do you want to go grab a burger and get out of the office and just go sit down. And have a conversation, have an opportunity to get to know them. And in those mentoring opportunities be able to share we'll just arise and bubble up out of those, just very natural and relaxed opportunities.

But you need to be intentional about saying, Hey, let's go grab a burger.

Jim: Yeah. It's all about just really taking your faith and putting into action in your workplace. And then as you get to know people, you can look for ways to pray with people. When you notice they're having a rough day. If you work with people long enough, you know what their normal demeanor is so that when they come in and they're having a rough day, you can tell, but it doesn't matter.

None of those other things really matter. If your work isn't really demonstrated by excellence. And as a retiree choosing to go back to work, you get an opportunity to live with intention. You get to choose where you work. You get to choose the job that you want to apply for, and you get an opportunity to just do it awesomely and demonstrate that for us.

And that says a volunteer and, and choosing to volunteer. But we also need to go ahead, Bruce, but I want to make sure we talk about people that need to go back to work.

Bruce: Well, there, there is that, but you know, that, that opportunity to, to, to, to take a step into the lives of those of the people that are around you, because no one really wants to hear, hear what you have to say.

Until they know that you care. So to be able to find those ways to demonstrate. So for example, when I was saying in our last couple of minutes ago, you know, let's go get a burger. When you go get

a

burger, you have an opportunity to pray to you. Nothing more than to bless the food.

Jim: And you can say, and you can say, Hey, I'm all ready to pray for the food.

Is there anything else you want me to pray about for now?

Bruce: I pray for you for you have the opportunity to ask the waitress, by the way, what's your name? Okay. Listen. Uh, we have, uh, we have a practice of praying before we eat is what can we pray for you for? So you have an opportunity to demonstrate what it means to reach out to someone else.

So you have that, that those relationships that you're acknowledging. You're stepping into and you're having, uh, the beginnings of what mentoring actually looks like, know

Jim: Bruce, this, all of these points apply, whether you're going back into the organization in order to volunteer, or whether you need to go back and make some money because in today's world, Bruce, you know, you're a financial adviser.

Yeah. People need money. I mean, the cost of fuel is doubled. The cost of groceries is up 25 or 35%. Everything is sky high in home. Insurance went up 30% here in Florida this year because of some storms and fires in Colorado or something like that. Everything's gone up for prices. Some people are like, I need to make some extra money.

My health insurance keeps going up, but my social security doesn't or whatever it may be. We've got that ability to choose the, iRetire4Him, mentality and intentionality in choosing a job. But one of the things we also need to make sure is that we make sure that we plant ourselves in a culture that's healthy, but not to agree to kill ourselves for our work.

Most of us have already done that. We don't need you to that retirement. You still got to leave some time for some fun, right?

Bruce: Well, I've got someone who works for, uh, works with us here and, uh, let's see, I think he's 67. If I, if I remember correctly every day he wears a suit coat or jacket and a tie. He's the only one in the office.

Who's got a tie. He has a tie on every single day. At first, we kind of kidded him about the tie and now we will respect him for the commitment that he has to being professional, being

here, being loyal,

be caring about other people and worrying that tie is one of those signs. And so we have a, we have an opportunity to be a witness and to mentor in lots of different ways.

Jim: In that choosing of where to go back to work. It's not, it, there's nothing to be embarrassed about. It's okay to go back to work. And some of you will go back to work cause you have to go. Some of you go back to work cause you're just bored out of your mind, just choose carefully. And that's really what Bruce and I are trying to communicate in this last segment.

You've got an opportunity to be choosy and in today's world where there are 12 million jobs available, 12 million jobs available, you can go anywhere and do anything. You can work at a grocery store, you can work at a restaurant. You can work in a manufacturing plant, you can work selling cars. If they've got any to sell, I mean, you could go anywhere and do anything.

Everybody is asking for help. And, you know, They love people with gray hair or white hair or bald like Bruce and I, because they don't have to worry about us showing up for work. Right. Prose.

Bruce: Exactly. And, but one of the things that we are attempting to do here is to encourage you to be able to step into that role.

We know that it's a little scary, a little different. You're wondering, you know, gee, I don't know the technology. Will I be able to have all those self-doubt issues? And from Jim and my heart, both of us step into that. There, there are companies and ministries that need you and you need them

Jim: just imagine the impact on your own life.

If you get to pour your heart into people, stop being at home, get out of the. Go go invest yourself in a place that you can be passionate about. Wherever that may be. I got a brother-in-law who loves golf, but can't swing a club anymore, but he went and worked at a, in a golf, uh, a store, a golf store, just cause he thought that will be fun because he got to speak truth into people.

We get to be Jesus, wherever we go and you are desperately needed. And as we finish out this four-part conversation about the book iRetire4Him, just here from my heart as Martha and I put this book together with her dad, Ted. Our overall mission was to say, you are valuable. You are desperately needed.

Please pour your life into somebody else. You're not done until God calls you home. And that's when you know that you'll be done. But until then you get a chance to practice saying iRetire4Him each and every day. Right. Bruce,

Bruce: not only practice it, but pass it on.

Jim: I love that. You've been listening to, I retired.

The mouthpiece for the retirement reformation with your host, Jim Brangenberg, of course, the founder of the retirement reformation, Bruce Bruinsma. We're just a couple of Christ followers, journeying from retirement to reformation. So we can ultimately say iRetire4Him

or for him.

Outro: Thanks for listening to, iRetire4Him.

With your host, Jim and Martha Brangenberg and retirement reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma book, iRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of retirement reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement. However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to love, serve and help others.

This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's work. Knowledge and experience and combine it with a greater freedom of time and more. And invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you. The retirement reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life, especially in retirement.

Take time to sign the manifesto@retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirement, reformation dot O R G.

3/14/22 - iRetire4Him Show 57: The Power of Mentoring

Intro: Well, retirement is generally seen as a time of relaxation and self focus. God calls us to love, serve and help others for a lifetime. He has been preparing us for this retirement season, literally our entire lives. In retirement, countless Christians enter a state of spiritual dormancy, not knowing how they are called to have an impact for God's kingdom.

The retirement reformation seeks to encourage and empower the 50 million Christians approaching or in return. To embrace the calling. God has been preparing in them when the world says it's time to stop. You can begin to have your greatest impact. Welcome to iRetire4Him. The mouthpiece of the retirement reformation, where our goal is to journey from retirement to reformation.

So you can say, I retire for him

Jim: reaching out to the 50 million Christ followers in America who are already in retirement, or maybe fast approaching retirement. You've turned into, iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the retirement record. Online at retirement reformation.org, retirement, reformation.org.

Please download our app retirement reformation can access to all the resources that we offer out there and get a membership to get access to even deeper resources like some one-on-one training and tutoring. It's all out there retirementreformation.org or on our app retirement reference. I'm your host, Jim Brangenbergnburg.

Of course, I'm joined by the founder of the retirement reformation, Bruce Bruinsma mom, perhaps the most underutilized talent in the kingdom of God is the talent and the ability of mentoring another. I once heard a famous speaker say that everybody should have a Paul Timothy and a Barnabas in their life.

What does that mean? It means that everybody should have a mentor. Everybody should have an encourager and everybody should be mentoring somebody not as far along in their walk with Christ. So how about you? Are you investing your life in another? Do you have anybody investing their life in you today?

Bruce, Bruinsma been, I are going to talk about the power and the value of mentoring and what it looks like to put it into action. This discussion is based on chapters four and five in the book iRetire4Him, found online@iworkedforhim.com forward slash bookstore. Bruce Price. Oh, welcome back to iRetire4Him.

Bruce: I'm really excited about our conversation today because I think it, it opens so many doors and it's so foundational to what God is calling us to do, and the opportunity that extends to every single Christ follower to be able to do it. There are no barriers to doing it. Other than the lies of the barriers that you may create yourself or someone creates.

So I'm, I'm really excited about the open door that mentoring in this whole topic, uh, will, will be for, for all of us as both a reminder and an encouraged,

Jim: well, let's get personal. Bruce, have you ever had a mentor in your life?

Bruce: I had a couple of mentors and, uh, in, and they come in a, in, in, in a series of different styles, some of them.

So for example, every Friday mornings, I, I go have breakfast at a little restaurant over here. And there's a, a good friend of mine who meets every Friday morning with one of the pastors from our church. And they are there every Friday. They have a mentoring relationship, and I know that's been a great value.

On the other hand, uh, I have the opportunity to be able to speak into the life. One time of a friend of mine in one set of circumstances that changed his life. And so mentoring has lots of different styles, but speaking into the life of another one, based upon the Christ experience and wisdom that you have is foundational to mentoring and exposes itself in lots of different ways, because God has called me into so many different roles.

I've had really a number of different mentors. You've got a business role and that kind of relationship that comes you have your spiritual role and that kind of relationship. You have your, your role as a. And those relationships. And so people have spoken into my lives, whether it be in a one-to-one conversation or maybe that mentoring took place because of a book that I read, mentoring has a whole series of different ways that God's message can be delivered internalized and that you can play a role in that process.

Jim: Yeah for me, I can't just have one mentor. I wear mentors out. I have two or three guys. Well, I have this one friend in Colorado. I consider a mentor. He's he could bald, it looks like me, but just wider. Yeah, Bruce. And I've got a couple other guys. My father-in-law being one and I have another guy that, that just feed into my life.

I need people that just are willing to smack me upside the forehead with a green treated two by four, because it forces me to go deeper in my faith. But as a kid, I, right after I became a Jesus follower, I had the. Of having a college kid pour his life into me. And I was a squarely kid. I'm still squarely at 55, but I was really squarely as a, as an eighth grader.

And this guy poured his life into me. And we're still friends today. So 42 years later, he still is willing to invest his life into me off and on he's travels, worldwide and trains pastors. My life wouldn't be the same without the mentors that I've had in my life, willing to just speak truth. And like I said, just hit me with a green tree at two by four when I need it.

But I've also seen the value of pouring in my life into others and, and Martin I've seen it even more in our marriage when we mentor marriages, other couples, it indefinitely is a refining force in our own marriage. First. Why do you think mentoring and. Yeah. I say discipleship is teaching others about Christ.

Mentoring is demonstrating teaching people, others about Jesus. Why do you think that's such a powerful force in the kingdom of God?

Bruce: Well, I think when you talked about education and then the difference of, of mentoring, I believe as a teacher, I always learned more than my students ever will because in fact, the work that I have to do to prepare a lesson, for example, Much more material, much more insight than, than I'm able to share.

So I always grow as a result of my teaching. I think there, the parallel to that is that I grow as much or more in a mentoring relationship. Because I'm listening to what God is saying. I'm pouring the experiences that I've had and what he's shared with me into their lives. And when that's happening, that is also being reinforced in my life as a, as a reminder, perhaps, or perhaps, huh?

Boy, I just shared this insight. From my experience, but I, I really had never thought of before. That was the holy spirit speaking through me. And I need to listen to what he is saying to me while I am sharing what he was saying through me to someone else.

Jim: You know, Bruce, one of the things I think is, is so amazing is that everybody listening today or almost ever, I think it's categorical, but I might be wrong.

Almost everybody feels. I bet I can't be a mentor. I don't have anything to offer. I feel inadequate to be a mentor. What do I have to pour of my life into somebody else? And that's what we need to change because everybody listening to the show today, everybody listening to the show today and the 50 million retirees in America have so much to offer.

And the next upcoming generations, they desperately need to know. Maybe they don't need technology. Huh? But what they need is interpersonal communications help. And they need to know, uh, how to, how to manage their time and manage their money. There's so many things they need that retirees know cause they've well, because they know, and that the younger generations need to know you.

Bruce: You wanted to close out this segment. I do just two thoughts. The first thought is that what they need to know is that when you screw up, you can recover. And all of us have experienced doing that. So we know what can come from making a mistake. And then I like to just close this segment with, with a quote, Jim, from, from your book, which I, I just highlighted it and I put a circle around it.

I put an exclamation mark next to it. Here's what it says. Listen to this. Every thing you have learned in your life, the good and the bad. Is what makes you a great mentor?

Jim: And with that, we'll be right back with more from iRetire4Him . As we get to talk to a Steve Barrett and he gets to share his story about having a mentor in his life, stay tuned.

Break: Membership has its privileges and with the retirement reformation, it's true. We have three levels of membership to access our growing wealth of resources. We also provide discipleship and training. To bring the retirement reformation alive in your life. So join us, go to retirement, reformation.org, and click on the membership tab.

Choose the level of membership that will help you rethink retool, reframe and reform your retirement today. The basic level is free, so you can get started today. Take the journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Retirement, reformation dot O R G. Let's get back to more. I retire

for him.

Jim: Hey, welcome back to, iRetire4Him, the mouthpiece for the retirement reformation. During every second segment of every podcast, we always interview somebody talking about their story of how they live out their faith in their retirement, or a story about retirement. And my friend, Steve Barrett from the joy FM right here at a Sarasota.

Shared with me a couple of months ago, a story of his mentor impacting in his life, his mentor, who just recently went to be with the Lord. Steve Barrett. Welcome to iRetire4Him. Thank you very much, Jim, Steve, over lunch a few months back as we were celebrating the launch of the U S Christian chamber of commerce.

You shared about your mentor, who was your mentor?

Steve Barrett: Uh, my mentor was a guy named Jim a. I think he was 78 years old when he passed about a year, year and a half ago. Uh, just a great guy.

Jim: What kind of impact did he have on your life?

Steve Barrett: Uh, golly, uh, you know, that might be a great question to ask my wife, uh, you know, because she understands the impact he had on my life.

Uh, just taught me, he showed me how to walk, uh,

Jim: Give me an example of that.

Steve Barrett: He told me things like, especially early in our relationship, our relationship started probably in 2017, maybe, but early on here, his message to me was slow down. You'll get there faster, you know, just, eh, that was true. In two respects. One is I do have a problem of ready fire. And just wanting to get stuff done.

I've got to be productive, you know, and yet slowing the pace and taking care, spending more time, doing it right the first time. Um, and enjoy. While I was doing it, you know?

Jim: So, um, well, if your wife's available, we can always pull her into the conversation, but I'll trust you with the answers. Um, you know, we've been friends for a very, very long time.

How did you meet Jim and how did you end up in a, in a mentoring relationship with him?

Steve Barrett: Uh, well, we, uh, had both been attending a series of meetings and I heard him share his views on life several times about on different subjects and, um, After a period of time, I asked him if he would mentor me. So when he said, and, uh, probably for the first year and a half, I guess it was your year to have wasn't kept up with exactly.

But we met every Wednesday afternoon at four 30 just to work through life. He took me through steps of, uh, walking out, um, So when so many areas of my life, I hate to be vague. I'm not trying to be Vegas, just golly. He helped me. He helped me process stuff, Jim.

Jim: Well, and it's amazing to have somebody walk alongside you.

Who's had all these years of experience, you know, he was, he was ahead of you, you know, a couple of decades and that's powerful to have somebody like that. It was such an honor to have them feed into your. Think about the biggest thing. Um, so you hung out together for three, three and a half years before he passed.

You spent that time together, uh, on Wednesday afternoons at four 30. What was it like? Did you have questions that you brought with you every time or did he say, okay, Steve, here's what I'm going to talk to you about today? How did it work?

Steve Barrett: Um, I asked him to teach me how to teach others, teach me. The things I need to know.

But teach them to me in a way that I can help somebody else. And mainly I took notes during those meetings, uh, just he would just talk and talk and sometimes on the subject we were dressing and sometimes on a related subject or what might be happening in our lives and how to handle situations, how to look at situations, how to change my thinking.

So that, uh, there wasn't that conflict between what I was thinking, what I was saying and what I was doing.

Jim: Um, it's all Romans 12:2 kind of moments change in the way of think. I like that. Okay. So what was Jim's background? Was he a professional mentor? Uh,

Steve Barrett: no. I don't know that he's ever been paid for in terms of dollars and cents.

He, uh, was, um, he was in the corporate world. I mean in a big way. This was back years ago. He's been retired for some time. All of his time, I've known him. He's been retired, but in the last 40 years of his life, I'm one of probably a hundred men or over a hundred men that he has mentored.

Jim: Wow. What an honor.

So you mentioned, well, we should really ask your wife the impact. How did having a mentor impact your marriage?

Steve Barrett: Um,

He has taught me to be, or help me learn his way. He would like to think of it. Um, he has helped me to learn to be more altruistic, more caring of other people's feelings. And, uh, uh, you know, I have a, a bit toward honesty. And he has helped me understand how to say things and do things in a way that are truthful, but not hurtful.

Jim: I love that. I love that

little bit of

progress, you know? Oh, that's, that's funny. You have a bent towards honesty and he just helped you make that bend. Just a little more kind is what. Oh, yeah. I thought all southerners were kind. You. I mean, you're, you're my most Southern friend. I think I have, you know, I thought all southerners were kind.

I mean, they could, you know, they, they always end it with bless your heart, which means you're just stupider than a sandwich, but it's nice. All right. So we'll, we'll get back. All right, Steve, should everybody have a mentor?

Steve Barrett: You know you that the easy answer would be yes, but you know, it's gotta be at the right time.

Uh, Jim, one of the things that, uh, Jim taught me was that you can't help people that don't want to be helped, you know? Um, they'll find somebody that wants to be helped, you know, but the real real thing he taught me was to, to mentor it is in, and this is where the conversation started. I think. W, uh, over lunch in Orlando, we talked about, uh, what he had told me toward the end of his life on a repetitive basis that is, is in giving that we receive it is in pardoning that we are pardoned.

It is in dying to ourselves that we are born to eternal life . And yeah. And, uh, that's what he, he showed me, you know, so.

Jim: So your, your mentor, Jim has been gone for a year, year and a half, as you said, have you sought out a new one yet? How come

Steve Barrett: I'm still learning from Jim, just as different situations. Come, come into my life. More of

what Jim taught me becomes. You know, so, um, I, and I may, or may not, I mentor a couple of people, the value and the real growth does not come and being mentored. The real growth comes when you begin to mentor, um, that's where it changes your life being mentored may or may not.

When you begin to mentor though, that's when. The light bulbs come on.

Jim: Yeah. That, and that was, that's the secret of Christianity. I think that people don't realize that when you start to disciple and mentor others, that is when your faith grows to a level that you can't even imagine. Steve looking back, uh, had you ever had mentors like Jim in your life before Jim entered your life in 17?

Steve Barrett: Uh, well, my pastor Craig, um, discipled me, um, For years on again on Wednesday night, I got, I don't know what that's funny. That would be the same day, but Craig and I, he, uh, we'd meet and he had always Bible study type stuff, but just walking with him and we're still good friends. We've got a lot of ball games together and stuff.

Um, yeah, there's

people I look up.

Jim: So when you look at your retirement years, which you're a long ways off from retirement, but when you look at your retirement years, how will Jim's influence on your life impact how you look at the value of your retirement years?

Steve Barrett: Um, I saw the people, how many people and to what degree, I knew several people that Jim had mentor.

Uh, and during the last year or so of his life, I had the honor on many occasions to take him to various medical appointments, but Jim was about 5, 7, 2 45. And with some neck issues, there was a period of time that I couldn't get him in out of the car by myself with a phone call, Jim, there was a half a dozen people I could call.

That would drop what they were doing and come help me if I needed help getting Jim in and out of the car. That's, that's how he affected people.

Jim: Hm. Wow. Is it your desire to be that Jim and somebody's life as you grow older?

Steve Barrett: Uh, sure. It would be an honor. And, um, yeah, well, we can't ever forget our greatest ministries at our house,

Jim: So what do you mean by that?

Steve Barrett: Oh, my, uh, am I Christ to my wife?

Oh,

that's where our ministry begins, you know, working from the inside out. And so the most important mentoring I can do is how I act and behave in front of my wife. And, um, again, Jim taught me again. Integrity or emotional sobriety is when your thoughts, your words, and your actions are all on the same plane when they're congruent.

And, uh, I enjoy that emotional sobriety today. Hmm.

Jim: I love that. And your kids are watching you and how you treat your wife. And that's how they're learning how to be married and treated. Uh, it's a powerful testimony. Steve Barrett. I appreciate you sharing your story about Jim. We want to honor Jim and the millions of other men and women that are out there mentoring others.

And that's really the message to the retirement reformation crowd is they listened to, iRetire4Him is pour your life into somebody else. It will, it will pay back. So many fold. It's such a powerful one. Steve. Thanks for sharing your story today.

Steve Barrett: Thank you, Jim. If all else fails, it'll help somebody.

Jim: We'll be right back with more. And iRetire4Him.

Every iRetire4Him. She'll go so quickly. We don't often get to remind you that there are two resources you should be checking out right now. I recommend that you get a copy of the retirement reformation book and the, iRetire4Him. Book retirement reformation focuses on the mindset and behavioral changes needed.

Well, let's just say paradigm shifting that is needed to live out your faith in retirement. iRetire4Him is focused on many of the ways you can put your faith into action by investing your life into others in your retirement years. Get both at the retirement reformation website and the bookstore at retirementreformation.org.

That's retirement, reformation.org.

Hey, welcome back to iRetire4Him. Fantastic storage loved here in Steve. Barrett's heart about his mentor. Let's talk about what it looks like to put mentoring into action for the everyday retiree right here in America. Bruce, what does that look like for you?

Bruce: One of the things, ways that it looks like for me is, is when I hear a little knock on my office door and, and one of my staff comes in and says, you know, I think we got a problem. And I said, it's 12. Tell me about it. And whether it's personal or it's related to ministry or whatever, it may be. And the opportunity for us to simply be able to identify what's true about the problem and to be able to explore together and to speak into the experiences that I've had or the way that I've seen that dealt with with others, or simply some plate to be a good questioner and pull from them what they can bring about solving that particular problem.

That's one of the ways that mentoring takes place. Another way that mentoring takes places is, uh, after our life group and someone comes up and says, you know, I wanted to ask you a question and he SP the question in my answer is, wow. Why don't we go to lunch? Let's talk about that a little bit more. I think there's, there's a whole bunch there that we need to really explore together.

And that leads to an ongoing dialogue from question a, to question B from challenge a to challenge B C to, to a circumstance that in fact we can, we can just share together. We can be legitimate. We can be real. We can be transparent and we can be got on.

Jim: Yeah, for me, Bruce, the mentoring, it looks like I have this group of guys that I pour my life into.

I call them the knuckleheads for Jesus, because I think they tend to be all like me kind of bull in the China shop, kind of people. You have people you resonate with and they all just, they need to ask the stupid questions to get it out of their system. And I get phone calls and I get text messages and I don't get emails from them, but they just want to note.

Most of them came to Christ later on in life. And they're just like, I want it just tell me the truth and, and don't pussyfoot around with me. I just want to know the truth and it's, it's fun. It's I look forward to those calls, uh, dealing with night, Martha and I were traveling south from north Florida to south Florida called one of those guys.

I've been praying for mentoring for a decade. And I said, You can buy it. You can buy us dinner, we'll stop by the highway, right by your exit. You can buy us dinner. We'll have an hour long conversation. We sat down with he and his wife who their marriage wasn't perfect, 10 years ago. And today it is so much better.

And his attitude towards work was a little twisted and screwed up today. He knows what it's like to run a kingdom company and it's, it was just so rewarding just to see the Lord use just conversations I've had. And then of course the holy spirit just pounded this, this guy all day long to see just amazing.

First I want to talk about from the book. I, I specifically really lay down. What does that look like to be a mentor in your neighborhood? And I, and I say this first thing I say, you know what, and this is something that really irritates me. I've lived in Florida almost 20 years now. And what I see is that retired people hang out together to the much to the detriment of the younger generations.

In fact, they build walls around their neighborhoods and call them gated neighborhood. And it's 55 plus. So it doesn't let any young people in, although in Florida, technically 80, only 80% or 55, plus you can have 20% that are younger, but the issue is I want to challenge everybody, listen to this. If you're living in a retirement neighborhood, get out while you can plant yourself in a neighborhood, fully young families.

Why? Because they desperately need you. Most young families today don't have access to married folks. They don't have access to grandparents because of. Or because of location, they need old people, or as we like to call them chronologically superior people in their lives. And Bruce, I came up with some ideas on how to break the ice with those younger families.

Can we talk about those today?

Bruce: Sure. Absolutely.

Jim: One of the things I know with these younger families and, you know, so I'm 55 Bruce year 80, and these younger families are in their twenties and they're. These kids today, they can't afford to go on a date if they have kids. Why? Because babysitting first, I know your grandkids are in well, they're in the academy.

Now whether the seniors eyes go, go into the academy or whatever that is, I know they're old, so you don't have that babysitters for them. But the average family today is paying 20 bucks an hour for a babysitter. So how do you go to dinner and a movie and a babysitter without spending 200 bucks. Most young families can't afford to do that.

Here's my first idea. I'll make friends with these younger couples offered a babysit for them offer to babysit for them. That's worth hundreds of dollars. Plus you get a chance to pour your life in these young kids who don't get access to old people very often you ever seen yet. What do you think about that idea of hers?

I think that's a great idea. And a version of that is the, is the single mom who never gets. And is always overworked. It never has time to go on a date, even if she had someone she wanted the, uh, or, or to go, just go to a movie or go read a book or whatever. So to be able to be aware of people who, who your time brings value to.

As well as the messaging that's there. I just think that's a absolutely great idea. And it's, it's so easy. I guarantee you, if you don't know who to do it with, just call your pastor and say which one of the young couples in the church, uh, do you think could use a break? He'll have three or four of them right on his list.

Give them a call and make that offer. And that begins a relationship because you ask him, you say, would it be okay if I showed up maybe 15 or 20 minutes early and we could talk a little. And so I could learn a little bit about your family so I can, I can even do a better job of taking care of your

kids.

Well, and that works with those couples at church, but in your own, if you plant yourself in a neighborhood, you've got an opportunity to build that relationship over time. Here's another thing I know is that young people love to eat, and most of them don't know how to cook real well, and they would love a home cooked meal.

So I'm fight these young families over to your home, put up all the breakables, make your home kid friendly, invite their whole family over and. Play some games. One thing I know about this, uh, the millennial generation and gen Z, they love board games. It's so funny. They're so tired of video games. They love board games, play board game, play card game, played dice game, play, you know, play some games and just let them get to know you so that when you offer to babysit, they'll go, oh, heck yeah, Bruce.

Here's another thing I've learned this younger generations because they've divorced has been so prevalent in their lives. They don't have access to grandpa. They don't know how to do stuff. We joked about an earlier show that a young generations don't even know how to, they don't know how to use a manual screwdriver, certainly not a manual screwdriver with a flat head screw.

They don't know how to do it. So I think, you know, I know in your household, Judy's the handy one. Right? But imagine if you took some time to, in your case, you could teach kids how to invest. I could teach kids how to fix stuff, how to detail their cars. Cause I D did that for years. Uh, Martha could teach them how to cook.

I can't teach them how to cook. I can teach them how to grill. Uh, but just everyday, how stuff like changing a light bulb or changing a light fixture or changing a light switch kits on how to do that stuff. And they don't have the money to pay people to do it. What about, what do you think? I mean, your grandkids or your grandsons that are football players and go into the academy, do they not a cook and clean and fix.

Bruce: Well, they better than most is my, my daughter is a real tyrant, but, uh, the, uh,

Jim: the show later, by the way,

Bruce: but you know, there are things, there are unique things that I have learned that I can share with them then have shared with them and will continue to share with them. It's you know, how do you read a balance?

How do you look at, how do you look at your, how do you go online? When you look at your bank statement, how do you read it? So, you know, how in fact understand what you've got and what happened? How do you set up a bank account? What is the difference between savings and bank in, in banking and all of this, those very basic things that they're, they don't teach in school and they need

Jim: to do.

Got friends in our lives, Dick and Karen Leibrandt they're in their late seventies now. And they said at an early age, when they were in their fifties, early fifties, they said, we're not going to hang out with people our age. We're gonna hang out with young people. It's going to keep us younger, but they need us in their lives.

And now they're their late seventies. So almost 30 years later, a lot of those kids they were hanging out with are now in their fifties, but they're still hanging out with the college kids and what I see. It changes the attitude of most young people. When they get exposure to chronologically superior folks, they get to understand and appreciate the wisdom that we can pour out to them.

And we become a resource. Even if we can't roller skate with them or play tennis with them, we can still be that resource and that listening ear. And that's what this is all about. Mentoring is pouring our lives into others. First, just imagine with me, as we close out the show today, what would it be like if every.

Christian retiree would pour their lives. And then the neighbor into the lives of their neighbors. What do you think it would look like? How do you think our country would change?

Bruce: Well, first of all, I would change our neighborhood and when a neighborhood changes, all kinds of things come out of that. I think it is.

That is a step that if we can take that and when we take it individually, make that decision, we can begin to chip away at our culture, which is eroding our life and we can make it better,

Jim: poor your life and this somebody else, if you're in a retirement neighborhood, move out while you can make some money on your house, move into a neighborhood full of young families, plant yourself.

That's like planting yourself on a foreign mission. Great conversation today, Bruce. And we're just want to encourage each one of you retirees, you have not done that. You've got so much life left in you to pour out into somebody else. You've been listening to. iRetire4Him the mouthpiece of the retirement reformation with your host Jim Brangenbergnburg.

And of course the founder of the retirement reference. First Brian Smith. We're Christ followers, just journeying from retirement to reformation of our retirement ideas. So we can ultimately say I retire for

Bruce: him. iRetire4Him.

Intro: Thanks for listening to, iRetire4Him with your hosts, Jim and Martha.

And retirement reformation founder, Bruce Bruinsma book, iRetire4Him is the mouthpiece of the retirement reformation. Most Christians tend to follow the world's pattern of rest and self pampering during retirement. However, in your retirement, you can be focused on God's unique call to love, serve and help others.

This can be your best season of life. If you take advantage of a life's worth of knowledge and experience. And combine it with a greater freedom of time and money and invest it all in the generations, both preceding and following you. The retirement reformation is encouraging Christians to find and follow God's call in all seasons and aspects of life.

Especially in retirement. Take time to sign the manifesto@retirementreformation.org and explore the wealth of resources available on our site. Join this movement of God and journey from retirement to reformation. So you can say, iRetire4Him. Go to retirement, reformation dot O R G.