iRetire4Him Show 146: This Retirement Lie is Stealing Your Purpose

Jim Brangenberg: Your retirement years can be 30 years of purpose-driven, fully funded ministry, years of making impact in ways and places you've never imagined.

Martha Brangenberg: Welcome to iRetire4Him. We are your hosts, Jim and Martha Brangenberg. Check us out online at iretire4him.com.

Jim Brangenberg: Did you know that 65 was a magical number? Yes, this one number, 65, has the power to change everything in your life. It has the power to end your job and send you on a permanent vacation. It has the power to kick in basically free healthcare for life. The number 65 is the magical yet made up number that everyone tracks their life by. When someone starts work at age 20, they only have 45 years to work, and then they'll get a well-deserved lifelong rest.

65 is magical, or is it? Since almost every movie has a villain and a hero, I'm here to introduce the truth about 65. It could be a villain and a hero - terrifying and terrific. It just depends on your perspective. Our guest today has a perspective on this magical 65 number thing, and she's here to debunk the magic all the way til the cows come home out there in Stanley, North Dakota. Danita Bye is from North Dakota. She's 65, and she has a story to tell. And maybe a small sermon to preach. Danita Bye, welcome to the show.

Danita Bye: I'm delighted to be here. Thank you for the invitation.

Jim Brangenberg: I hope you feel that way when we're done. Danita, this is what you say. You say, traditional retirement is dangerous in this epic moment because it silences our sages, benches our mentors, and vacates the gates of influence just when the world most needs wisdom, courage, and truth. In fact, you summarize this by saying the church's view on retirement is terrifying. That's a strong statement.

Why do you say that?

Danita Bye: It was Elon Musk who used the word terrifying when he introduced Grok 4, and he introduced it last week, and he said that it's smarter than all graduate students in all disciplines performing at a PhD level, across the board. And when he introduced it to the global media, he used the word terrifying and unnerving.

So he used that word, and I wanna say dangerous, but you're right, it could be terrifying that during this time of just incredible shifting and changing, I believe it is that our spiritual sages have been silenced and our mature spiritual mentors have been set on the bench because of this 65 number, and that is dangerous for the world. That's what I think, Jim.

Jim Brangenberg: 10 years ago, maybe even longer, I said that for so long we've been sticking our retirees back in the grandstand, out in the grandstand. And I say, no, let's get 'em back in the field. Maybe they don't need to run the plays anymore, but they need to get on the field as coaches, as mentors, to pour into the next generations.

Maybe they don't have the ability to maneuver like the current generations, young generations, certainly on the internet with AI, which is exploding. Even just this year, in six months, it has exploded. Explains everything John ever said in Revelation. It explains it all. But why do you think... is this something when you, 20 years ago, you were 45, at the peak. You were vaulting into success all over the place.

Minneapolis, I believe you're still back then, working in Minneapolis. Did you imagine that at 65, you'd be sent off to the pastures and people wanna set you off to the side, stick you in a small group with a bunch of other old people and say, Hey, us young people, we got it. Is this current observation this terrifying thing or have you always known 65 was terrifying?

Danita Bye: I don't think I've known that 65 was terrifying, but there are three things that come together to make this season so terrifying. One is the AI revolution. You may have heard last week President Trump had the speech of a lifetime: "winning the race, America's AI action plan."

And he talks about that all this scientific and technology that we're having is going to change the world, the way we live and work. It's couched with breakthrough technologies, but when you have robots like they are in Revelations, when you have some organizations that are trying to create God, that's terrifying. And then you combine with that these 85 million retirees who have so much wisdom and insight and knowledge and discernment that, that they've gathered over the years, especially our biblical followers of Jesus, those are the ones that they cannot be set on the bench.

We have got to activate them. And then the third factor that comes in here is across the nation is this incredible loss of purpose. Statistics are that at least 30% of retirees feel a lack of belonging, a lack of meaning. Over 50% of millennials and Gen Z have a lack of belonging, a lack of meaning. So we have this massive crisis in purpose. So we have this AI, where the world is speeding up at unimaginable paces, and then we bring that together with our wisdom, which is slowing down, sitting on the bench, taking it easy...

Jim Brangenberg: playing pickleball

 (laughter)

Danita Bye: Playing pickleball. (laughing) And then we have, even the young people have this restlessness that they're looking for or that they're feeling, and it sparks me to wonder about what will happen if we as leaders, as spiritual leaders, don't step up to the plate.

Jim Brangenberg: I think I could tell you what happens, and we'll let Martha jump in here anytime she wants.

I think that's where euthanasia fits in, because they've already said, Hey, you chronologically superior folks, you folks 65 and older, stay off to the side. Eventually you say, Hey, you're in the way, so let's just get rid of you. Hey, you can end your purposeless life on your own. They do it in Canada already. They're doing it all over Europe already.

Yeah, they're just gonna say, Hey, if you have a purposeless life, go ahead and end it so you're not in the way and wasting money, 'cause the boomers are almost done retiring. So in another three, four years, the boomers will be done hitting age 65. And I know that because we're not boomers, we're Xers, but we're at the very beginning. We're right at that little tip there. But that's where this heads to " my life is, has no purpose. Therefore, I don't wanna have a pulse."

But we say if you've got a pulse, you do have a purpose! If you are not dead, you're not done! When you retired, your calling didn't retire! Martha?

Martha Brangenberg: Okay, so Danita, I knew that this would be hard for me to get a word in edgewise with the two of you. (laughter) But I love it. And I believe our listeners love it too, if they're really paying attention to where this conversation is gonna go.

Because these are ideas that we're just chipping away at a little bit and saying, what does God really want for us as believers in every stage of our life? You talk about the younger ones that feel purposeless or restless and not sure what the future's gonna hold, and yet we have been told all of our lives that, of course retirement is at the end of our long career.

And we have a different perspective on that and I hope that the listeners will be challenged to do some introspective work and to really pray with the Lord and say, what is that stage of life supposed to look like for me? And really believe in the calling that God has placed on each individual person's life, that does have purpose.

So Danita, unpack this a little bit more. What do you think it is about retirement that you don't agree with as a word or as a concept? Talk about retirement.

Danita Bye: Two things come to mind. The first one is the scripture. Psalms 90:12, I believe, "teach me to number my days that I may be wise." Now it was irritating to the max that the Holy Spirit brought that to my attention when I was like 26 years old. All my friends are out, American Dream, making it happen, and the Holy Spirit is inviting me: "Teach me to number my days." What does that mean, spiritually and relationally and physically and intellectually and financially?

The Holy Spirit has been haunting me with that. Quite irritating. (laughing) People are out like having fun. They're playing pickleball, they're golfing, they're doing, they're, taking the trip of their lifetime.

Jim Brangenberg: Have you ever been golfing? People that are golfing are not having fun. Mark Twain said it 200 years ago almost: "golf is a good walk spoiled." The pickleball, we've done pickleball. Pickleball is actually pretty fun.

Danita Bye: No, I've done pickleball too. It is fun.

Jim Brangenberg: It is fun.

Danita Bye: But I had another one that connects with that.

Martha Brangenberg: Yeah.

Danita Bye: I was hosting a friend of mine from Tanzania. Her name is Chilwah. She had been a governmental official, had been Muslim most of her life, had recently come to the Lord. I was hostsing her in Minneapolis and I was so excited for her to meet one of my spiritual mentors, Priscilla, and Priscilla was in a retirement community in Minneapolis.

It was the nicest retirement community, and as we entered the door to this beautiful plush facility that's filled with spiritual leaders, I notice outta the corner of my eye that Chilwah has tears streaming down her face. And I'm like, my first thought is, did I offend her? Was there a cultural faux pax that I made?

And I leaned over and asked, what's wrong? And she said, I cannot believe what you do to your elderly. And I'm like going, what in the world is she talking about? This is a beautiful place. She said, in our country, it is a deep honor to take care of our elderly and what we get in return is all their wisdom.

Wow. Now that rattled me. And I begin to think about what are the consequences of silencing the very leaders that we should be listening to? And what if the exact wisdom, insight, knowledge, and discernment that we need for these increasingly crazy times, what if it lies with our spiritual elders?

And so those are some of the questions that I raise as the Holy Spirit challenges me to think about how I do my life. Even though, or considering I'm 65, how am I called to continue to live out what God has laid out before me?

Martha Brangenberg: Yeah. Such powerful concepts. Such a different way of looking at life. Specifically here in America, we think they've reached the ultimate if they can be in a place of luxury and have everything taken care of for them. And yet we've disconnected the spiritual leaders with those that need the influence, not even purposefully, thinking that we're maybe doing a good thing, but yet it's made such a separation between where the wisdom can be flowing into the next generations.

Danita Bye: I have to add one other thing. I grew up in North Dakota. This is a homestead territory. People who moved here at all times in life, we have had to accept grit and determination from the moment we wake up until our last breath. So built into the culture, the ranching and farming culture, is this innate DNA to give and to contribute. So that's another gift I bring, which is actually a little irritating to my husband who would prefer that we would play pickleball a little bit more often.

 (laughing)

Jim Brangenberg: And go to Florida probably. If you've ever spent a winter day during a blizzard in North Dakota, you know that when the wind starts in Montana, it doesn't stop till it gets to Duluth. It's just unbelievable.

But what you just said about your friend from Tanzania is so powerful because I have often said that we have convinced all of the elders of our country to move to Florida and Texas, and used to be California, now it's Arizona. But move to the south away from everybody that you know and away from everybody that you care about, including your grandkids, so you can live in 55 plus purgatory. Because that's what it's all about. You live in a homeowner's association, run by formerly militant individuals who are now militant as a homeowner's association.

And you lose your freedom, but you're hanging out with a bunch of people who are in the same spot and you don't get to influence your grandkids. You get to see 'em a week a year maybe, unless you go home, and you're a snowbird.

And it's so true. We, our society has been designed around pushing chronologically superior folks off to the side because it's inconvenient. They're a little bit frustrating, or they move at a different pace than we do. They wanna tell us stories. Oh yeah, I like telling stories. I'm not quite 65 yet, I like telling stories. But it's so dangerous. It's just dangerous what we've done, and she's hit the nail on the head that a lot of other cultures that are honor cultures would never think about doing that.

But we are not in an honor culture here as many Asian and Middle Eastern cultures are. Talk about something else that's dangerous? When we allow most of our input to come from society at large without putting it through a biblical filter. That's why we love the US Christian Chamber of Commerce. We surround ourselves with people who love business, love Jesus, and love the truth. The US Christian Chamber of Commerce has many different opportunities for members to connect and learn. And in 2026, you can attend a huge event in Orlando, swc2026.com. Use code iWork4Him. Get signed up, be there. We'll be there, and you'll be surrounded by people from all over the country who wanna see business impacted by the kingdom.

All right, Danita, let's talk about consequences. Consequences of our actions. We've already talked... your friend's example is fantastic. Why do you do this to your people? Let's talk about the wide ranging consequences on our American economy and on the church in America. Let's talk about that because the church in America should be influencing the American economy. We have $29 trillion of assets in Christian control that are in our 401Ks. And we're spending it on houses on the water in Florida that get blown over by hurricanes. What are the, what do you see as those wide ranging consequences of traditional retirement?

Danita Bye: The area that I think about is AI, and I think of the consequences to our grandchildren and our great-grandchildren. Excuse me, if we're even around for our great-grandchildren and how are they going to discern? How are they going to navigate? There's historians say once every 500 years that there's such a revolution in how we live and how we think they call that time "epoch." E-P-O-C-H.

So think of like the industrial revolution, and we are in the middle of that type of change happening. Personally, I think this is more than a once every 500 years change. I think this may be once in a history of the world change and I think of, there was a book I read called The Coming Wave by an AI expert, Sulliman, and listen to this quote, he says, "this coming wave of technology is bringing human history to a turning point. The consequences for our species are dramatic, potentially dire."

Jim Brangenberg: But we know it's not dire. Sorry to interrupt you, but we know it's not dire because the Bible talk doesn't talk about the elimination of the human species until the end. So we know that part. This guy doesn't have a biblical perspective.

Danita Bye: But we have, there are people around the world, so I just think through how in the world does my grandson, Evan, who's currently 10 years old, how is he going to navigate this? How is he going to balance this? How is he gonna discern? And there's a part of me that says, oh, I should be and I am concerned about the economy for the United States. I am concerned about my grandchildren. And how in the world are they gonna navigate this? How are we gonna help them? What kind of tools, what kind of resources?

And so for me that is the biggest consequence is our children. And I guess as I think about it, the people in America have not necessarily made decisions that prioritize children and prioritize the future. I think of abortion. I think of euthanasia. That those are issues that we as a culture have had to wrestle with. My biggest concern is our grandchildren and how are they going to navigate this with a biblical framework.

As an aside, and I'm interested in the the Christian Chamber Organization, a friend of mine, you may know him, Jim Garlow, he has a number of time mentioned to me that with the America 250 celebration that we're doing, that it's so important that the people of God understand the difference between the biblical foundations of our country and the enlightenment foundations of our country.

I thought that was interesting 'cause I didn't know the difference. So I go to my friend chat GPT and ask what are the differences? And I'm like going oh, Danita, there are some things that are clearly biblical, but there's a couple of other things that I've bought into the Enlightenment agenda. So I need to challenge myself. We'll have that one as a next discussion.

Martha Brangenberg: There you go. Okay, but you bring up a great point because without true biblical discernment, it is hard to know what things we've accepted as being biblical or some other agenda. And we often talk about, and we said it earlier in the show, a lot of people believe that the American way of retirement and the American dream is biblical, yet the Bible does not discuss retirement unless you are a Levitical priest. And even then you continue to mentor. So you give up the cutting, but you teach others how to do the trade.

So you know, I was sitting here thinking about what you were saying, and it drew me back to conversations where Jim, you and I would sit with my grandparents and actually sit in the living room and have conversations about things they've learned in life that they wanted to pass on to us. It brings me to tears to even think about it because we don't do that anymore. Yes, there may be families that have pockets of time where they do things like that, but the level of intentionality that my grandparents generation had towards us was so powerful. And yet we took it for granted. Because we just thought that's the way it was.

Jim Brangenberg: We still drove 350 miles to go see 'em.

Martha Brangenberg: We drove a long ways to go see them, and they were very intentional, and grandpa was a very good storyteller. So it was enjoyable to sit and hear about the past and the things that God has taught them. But the lessons that we learned in those conversations are priceless.

And I think what I'm hearing you say is that if we resort to learning everything by AI, that one of the dangers is gonna be the personal touch. The trial and error that came from other generations saying, I did this and it failed and this is what I learned and this is how I changed and God taught me this lesson. You don't get that with a straight line of fact that might be proposed to you. Those are some of the dangers of taking the personal out of relationships as people look at how they retire and what they do with their futures.

Jim Brangenberg: And you can understand why people used to say, let's go get a cave. Let's go buy a cave. We'll go live in a cave and protect our families from all the stupid that's coming, right? 'cause for the last a hundred years, a lot really for the last 150 years, a lot of stupid has come in waves. And people are like, let's get outta here. Let's go wait until Jesus comes back and hide in a cave.

And maybe Jesus is around the corner 'cause this AI thing is cutting edge, but I know that's not what we're called to do. We're called to engage the world, we're called to bring the kingdom to earth. And I wanna finish up a conversation talking about what are you saying to yourself about your next 25 years?

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All right, Danita, this conversation's amazing and I think we could probably go on for three or four hours, but we can't, 'cause people maybe stop listening, but maybe we'll come back. You never know.

I wanna know, based on everything you've talked about, the terrifying things we've talked about, the scary things we've talked about, the frustrating things we've talked about... you are 65. Knowing you, you've got at least 25 years of running outta you. Maybe just 20, but maybe till your mid eighties, maybe till 90. What are you saying to yourself today about how you're gonna handle your retirement years? Because the world is telling you, check out. Sit on your cash, enjoy the good life, go play some pickleball with Gordon, but what are you saying to yourself?

Danita Bye: So there's a couple of things the Holy Spirit's been working with me on during this season that, I call it the "Moses speaking strategy." Moses was effective because he heard what the Lord said and spoke it. So I have to tell you what the Holy Spirit's working with me on.

Jim Brangenberg: Okay, fair enough.

Danita Bye: First is prayer. So my friend Jim Garlow, recommended a book he said changed his life. I'm going wow, changed his life? I better read it. It's a book called Destined for the Throne, how Spiritual Warfare Prepares The Bride of Christ for Her Eternal Destiny.

Jim Brangenberg: Show a picture of it on the screen so people can see. Okay. All right. If you're watching this on YouTube, you can see a picture of the book, Destined For the Throne by Paul Billheimer.

Danita Bye: Paul Bilheimer.

Jim Brangenberg: Bilheimer. Okay.

Danita Bye: This is not a normal book on prayer. I've had to stop and I've spent a couple weeks on page 46. John Wesley says, " God does nothing but in answer to prayer." And then E M Bounds says, "prayer should be the main business of our day."

I ask myself, if God does nothing but an answer to prayer, how am I praying for my grandkids? Not just God bless them, but how am I really praying for my grandchildren? How am I praying for my kids as they parent and their marriages, not just bless the marriage? How am I really praying for them? What about my work on the state board of higher ed?

I believe that God has called me as their assignment. Am I really praying about it? And we're starting a classical Christian school. We believe this is a God thing, but if God does nothing but in answer to prayer, do I really believe that? And so that's one of the places where the Holy Spirit is challenging me.

And I think that's a place to challenge all of us that are over 65. Many of us have extra time. We at least have control of our schedule, and I'm sure we all know that prayer is not just sitting down. We can be praying all over the place, but is prayer one of the ways that we stay engaged, that we be intentional, that we be strategic? Is prayer one of the ways that we lead during this time when the world is nuts and becoming increasingly dangerous for all of us?

That's a place. The second place that the Holy Spirit has me working is going back and looking at revisiting vision, mission, and values. And Gordon and I participated in a one day workshop where we worked through this together and Gordon and I had to talk through different, you know, whenever you work with it together as a team that's always a challenging experience, but so valuable.

Because it helps us, it gives us some common language to say are we focused, are we on target? Are we involved in things that God has graced him with? What about me? How are we doing this together? So that's another exercise that we've done recently is to revisit our vision, mission, and values together.

Jim Brangenberg: That's good. Okay. So in the answer to the question then, how do you see God laying out your next 20 years? Has he given you a vision for it? Has he given you a vision for the next five? And I take it none of it involves a lifetime of pickleball, tennis, golf, and the beach.

Martha Brangenberg: No, but knowing Danita, there's probably a little four-wheeling involved or hiking or something.

Danita Bye: Maybe some hiking and some walks and some of those types of things. There's a couple of things, when I look at my own priorities, obviously grandchildren, you can tell grandchildren, whatever we need, I'm going to be there.

Like you, parents. We are called to honor our parents. And so what does honoring look like? And that's gonna be very different for each of us. For me, i'm healthy. Some people aren't, and that's going to shift what they're working with. But I'm healthy and my intent is to be like Moses and Joshua and the people in the Bible to finish strong. And to keep going and to keep challenging myself and to challenge other people.

As I was thinking about our time, I remembered a conversation. I was 14 years old and I was in an adult bible study and I was the only teenager in that adult bible study, and we were looking at Mark 10. And it seemed to me that we skipped over Mark 10:27 completely: "with man this is impossible, but with God, all things are possible." So as any 14-year-old would do in an adult Bible setting, I said I think this is really an amazing verse. All things are possible with God. And the pastor not only looked but locked eyes with me and says, Danita, it says that, but it doesn't mean that.

Jim Brangenberg: How sad.

Danita Bye: How sad. And in the world of leadership studies I had what was called a word test. Whose word am I going to believe? And I see that as impacting this next season that I have. There are things that are bubbling up within me. We're starting this Christian school in Stanley, in the Northwestern corner of North Dakota, 80 miles from the Canadian border, 80 miles from the Montana border. And I mentioned to someone we were doing this and he said, that's impossible to do.

Jim Brangenberg: Ah, that's exactly why you should be doing it 'cause it's impossible.

Danita Bye: That's exactly why we should be doing it. So it's almost like the challenge, one of the places where I'm challenging myself is, what are some of those things that God has placed in my heart that look and sound impossible? Let's start praying about them.

Jim Brangenberg: Amen. Danita, what an incredible conversation. I loved it. I'm so grateful that you just poured your heart out, and it's exactly how we feel. That's where iRetire4Him came from, as a side ministry to iWork4Him, is that we cannot afford as a country, as a church, as a body of Christ, to allow the brain drain, the wisdom walk.

I just thought of that, wasn't even written down.

Danita Bye: That was good.

Jim Brangenberg: Can I keep going? That's good. Yeah. Is there a rap there?

 (laughter)

Danita Bye: That was good.

Jim Brangenberg: We can't afford for this to happen. And yet it is "impossible" to change the tide of this in the church in America. It's impossible to change it in the tide of the economy of America. So it's impossible. That's why we should be doing it.

Martha Brangenberg: With God all things are possible.

Jim Brangenberg: Exactly. And it's a Romans 12:2 paradigm shift. We have to change the way we think. Danita, I would love to pick up this conversation again one day in the near future to hear what God has revealed to you even further about retirement.

And for all of you listening, you know, we're releasing this as an iWork4Him and iRetire4Him podcast for one reason only: I want everybody to have this perspective. If you're working, you're not done at 65, and if you're retired, you're not done either. People seriously - get off the pickleball court, get in the word and get out in the community. 'Cause the community that you live in desperately needs you.

Martha Brangenberg: Actually stay on the pickleball court, get in good shape so that you have the energy to do everything that God has called you to do.

Jim Brangenberg: Because motion is lotion, that's what they say. When we get older, motion is lotion. (chuckling) Danita Bye, thank you so much for being with us today.

Danita Bye: Thank you. It's an honor.

Jim Brangenberg: You've been listening to iRetire4Him with your hosts, Jim and Martha Brangenberg. In this retirement phase of life, I want my life to be full of meaning and purpose so I can say iRetire4Him.