4/23/25 - 2091: Choosing a Kingdom Company

Jim: You've tuned into iWork4Him, the Voice of Collaboration for the Faith and Work Movement. I'm your host, Jim Brangenberg. Our mission is to inspire every workplace believer to recognize their workplace as their ministry place where they work with God every day. What can that look like in your workplace? Let's find out right now.

Not all of us will have this opportunity, but our guest today could have retired to experience the American dream of retirement, but she chose a different path. She chose to eliminate the job that was causing her stress, and she moved her skills to a kingdom company with a kingdom purpose so that her paid work legacy would end on a high note.

Is this for everyone? Obviously not. But for Sue Wilson, the choice was a no brainer. Sue Wilson is a long time member of the iWork4Him board of directors and serves as our treasurer. Sue's here today to share her story and encourage all of us to never give up. She's also my sister. Sue Wilson, welcome back to, iWork4Him.

Sue Wilson: Thank you.

Jim: I like call her my squeezy sister. I call her many other things, but some of them will not go published today. All right. But [00:01:00] she's my favorite sister.

Sue Wilson: And your only sister.

Jim: Oh that. All right, so Sue, you could have retired. Why didn't you just check out and live the retirement dream?

Sue Wilson: I had a passion that I wasn't done yet, that God had more for me and that I wasn't ready to just slow down and maybe change lanes and do something different. I feel like I am finally at a point in my career where I am ready to really give back, that I am passionate about the people part of what I do every day, and less passionate about the technical aspects that I've been doing for 40 plus years now.

Jim: Oh my 40 plus years. You must be very old.

Sue Wilson: Older than you.

Jim: You are. Alright, so you've been a CFO for a ton of years. Was it obvious that God equipped you for this or is this just something you happened upon?

Sue Wilson: I'm a CFO. And I loved accounting from the time I was in... actually, my senior year of high school.

Jim: Kind of a sickness.

Sue Wilson: Yeah it is, but what I will tell you is that God, if I look in the [00:02:00] rear view mirror, God's path has been deliberate. It's been orchestrated, and I can see all the different places he's placed me and why he's placed me there because I think each one prepared me for the next one. There's skills that I've learned. There's been parts of me that he's tenderized. There's been other parts that he's made tougher. There's parts that he's opened my eyes to some things that I needed to know and be a little bit more skeptical about, and others where he's made me more passionate.

Jim: And it's obvious you've had a lot of fun doing a lot of different things. We even got a chance to work together for four years when you were helping be the CFO of a bank and I merged my agency with that bank. That was fun working side by side for four years.

You've worked for banks, you even helped start a bank. You've worked for Christian colleges, you've worked in the construction world, you've worked in the water business, the water purification business. What's a common thing you have witnessed at all of your past jobs? Both good and bad. What do you what have you seen, Industry standards?

Sue Wilson: I think the one common really good [00:03:00] thing is that there's some amazing people to work with every day. There's people that love what they do, that love life, that love doing a good job, that like to have a part of something, a success. And there's also a lot of people who own businesses that are passionate about what they do and they like to share it with their company staff. And that's been really the fun part of it, is to just breathe into some of those owners and to those staff people and watch them just create and grow and mature.

I think the tough part is that every business is run by people, and people are complicated and people will hurt you and people will step over you and step on you. And some of it's deliberate and some of it's not. And so that's consistent. Doesn't matter whether it's a kingdom business or not, just so you know. That is something that's just there that you, as you mature in your career, you'll come to recognize, and you'll also come to appreciate that [00:04:00] more and you can handle it a little bit better, and you can actually make it better.

Jim: You've worked for some Christians and you've worked for some pre-Christian, pre believers... or. I'm gonna say you've worked for some Christians and some pre believes. What have you seen, even before we started iWork4Him 12 years ago, what have you seen pretty typical amongst corporate Christians?

Sue Wilson: Ooh, lots of things. Some of them really understand what it means to be a Christian running a business, and they really give their business up to the Lord and they really just focus on, how can I praise the Lord, honor the Lord in everything I do? And others are still very focused on the business side and they wanna make a buck but they use those dollars to give to ministries and to give away. So I've seen Christians and Christ followers and pre-Christians have a heart for ministry, for God, and they handle a little differently. Some [00:05:00] of them are very people focused. Some of them are very business focused, but they do give and they give very generously. They're very philanthropic.

Jim: Wow. That was a totally glass half full, really half full kind of an answer, but I also know you've worked for some Christians who maybe hadn't figured out that God wanted to be involved in their work.

Sue Wilson: I have. And that's frustrating because they will vocalize the fact that they're a Christian or a Christ follower, but they don't actually act that way. They don't act that way. They act like it's their money. They did it. God didn't have any part of it. And then when you call them out on it, it gets to be a little tense. But I also feel like those were places where God placed me to plant seeds and to convict their hearts and to show them what it looks like from the other side. And some of those conversations have been tough, but the Lord has placed me in some really good opportunities where I've gotten to pray with them and actually expose some of what it looks [00:06:00] like in appearance to all the people that are working underneath of them.

Jim: And I think here's something that would've been really helpful for you when you're working in the Minneapolis area, is to join a local Christian Chamber of Commerce. Did you know there's one coming to Minneapolis?

Sue Wilson: I did hear that 'cause you told me.

Jim: That's right. So if you wanna, if you're listening today and you wanna do business with people who share your values, the US Christian Chamber connects you to a national network of faith-driven businesses committed to excellence and ethics.

Join the movement today, us christian chamber.com and through your membership in the US Christian Chamber, you can get connected to a whole bunch of local Christian Chambers. I think there's now 21 across the country, where you can get connected locally and start to talk to people there locally. So you can network nationally and locally all at the same time. US christian chamber.com.

Alright, so when you decided to leave your last job, what were you looking for in a new position?

Sue Wilson: First of all, I was looking for a little bit of peace because I had a really tumultuous year.

Jim: It's also why she lives in Minnesota and I live in [00:07:00] Missouri because sometimes I cause her to lose her peace!

Sue Wilson: No, not you.

Jim: Oh, not me? (laughing)

Sue Wilson: But I think that it really, I wanted to find a place where I could take everything I had learned, all my technical skills and really breathe into that next gen, to find that next generation of leaders that were gonna replace me when I retire and try to do some other kinds of ministries, and that I could equip them, that I could teach, that I could coach, that I could mentor.

So for me this position I'm in right now, I just have finished building out a team. I started with one person, now I have six. And I have that right team. I have a group of people who are coachable, that wanna grow, that are super excited about what I'm training them on and giving them big picture. And I share information that I think my bosses are a little bit surprised I share. But I said no, for them to see the whole picture, for them to understand why we do what we do every day, and some of the [00:08:00]things that they might take over, they gotta know it. And so they're having fun. They like the fact that I'm investing in them.

Jim: What does that look like? Accountants and CPAs having fun. Does that mean we have colored spreadsheets or do we get our calculators out and have calculator races or?

Sue Wilson: No, actually, we read numbers between the lines.

Jim: Oh. So we do have spreadsheet playing. Very nice. Yeah. All right. Alright. But God got you this job. And if you're listening and you're like, gosh Jim, you're really being hard on your guest - she's my sister! All of my life she's been my sister. It's just part of the love. Alright. But God did something really cool on how you found this job.

Sue Wilson: So I had decided to just do a random search and it truly, this is like a miracle story so listen in. I was just doing a search and I said Minnesota CFO jobs available. And I found a list, and I was going through the list, and I found this job. It was out there and it combined my banking background, which was about 30 years of my career and the things that I'd been [00:09:00] doing, and it was a business that would allow me to work remotely.

And it was a business that said they were faith-based and I thought, this is interesting. Send it over to my husband who's sitting in the other reclining chair. He says, this looks good. Why don't you actually apply? So I sat down right away, applied, sent a cover letter, and it went to a search firm. And I got a immediate reply back that said, Hey, got everything from you, you'll hear from us in the next two to three weeks. And I thought, okay, good. At least I know they got it.

So the next morning I got a phone call and the phone call was from the recruiter and the recruiter said, Hey, very interested. Love your resume. When can we talk? Then we set up a time to talk. I actually drove out of the parking lot from my current job and did this at McDonald's in the parking lot, and her first question was, I have to ask you, where did you get the job posting? And I said what do you mean? I found [00:10:00] it on the internet.

She said that job wasn't posted anymore. We had gone through the process to do a search. We had found two people, we had brought them in. We had decided to offer someone a job. They didn't accept it, and we were just wrestling with how are we gonna repost the job. What's it gonna look like? What are we gonna tweak? It wasn't posted. It hadn't been posted for almost a month. And so that was my miracle because when I went back out to try to find it again after I heard that, I couldn't find it.

So God placed that in front of me. Fun story, isn't it?

Jim: Just a coincidence, I'm sure. (with sarcasm) all right, so And you love your new job.

Sue Wilson: I love it.

Jim: Yes, you do. All right. But here, Dr. Jim, the skeptical one here on the iWork4Him podcast, when someone tells you they're running a company according to biblical principles, how do you make sure they're telling the truth before you sign the dotted line and take the job? How do you make sure?

Sue Wilson: Yeah. That was actually a fun thing for me this time because I am a little smarter than I was 35 or 40 years ago. So I had some [00:11:00] questions that I really needed to ask that were really about them personally, what they believed about, how they treat people. I asked them, where do you give your money? Where do you actually invest financially?

I ask them about what are the tough things that you've done to shape this business so it is truly faith-based? And how are you investing in the clients? Which we have. We have investors, we have residents. We have manufacturing employees, so we have a whole bunch of different constituents or stakeholder groups.

And so I wanted examples. What are you doing in each of these areas to love on them and to actually show them who Christ is? And so we had some really good conversations. Really good.

Jim: What's the difference? 'cause you've had some companies you've worked for that said they were run on biblical principles, even a Christian college. But what's the difference between a company or an organization run on biblical principles and an actual kingdom company?

Sue Wilson: A kingdom company is one that's actually focused [00:12:00] on the great commission to go and make disciples, to actually share who Christ is and to bring people to Christ, to a knowing knowledge of Christ.

You can have lots of values and principles that help you shape a business and make it a good business, a place that you wanna work, but if you also have a biblical principle based company that believes in the kingdom expansion, they are investing in people. My current boss says it this way: we invest in people through work. So he's literally focused on the people side, but we do it while we work.

Jim: Well, and what's great is what you're doing is part of really a kingdom company. A biblical company's gonna have good character. They're gonna talk about things. They are gonna lead people to Christ, but a Kingdom company also makes sure that everybody they're impacting is flourishing by what they're doing, whether those people believe in Christ or not. And a kingdom company makes their neighbors better off. And I really think that the company you're working for now, it's making [00:13:00]the neighbors better off.

Sue Wilson: It certainly is. And I will tell you that we have lots of people who aren't Christians that work with us, but we pray with them and we talk about Christ. We have the opportunity to really invest in them. And some of them I think are really close. And others that just love the gratitude and the expression of love and how we treat each other, even when we disagree. And they're just, they admire that and they feel peace. So some people just like the work environment that it creates and others truly are curious

Jim: Christians that disagree?

Sue Wilson: Yeah.

Jim: Weird. All right. What do you do when you disagree? Do you guys actually have to work it out? Do you have a company rule that says if you have a disagreement with somebody, you have to work it out?

Sue Wilson: We do. We follow the biblical principle of one-on-one confrontation. Because confrontation is actually good, to go through the problem. And then if it's not resolved, then you do that small group on one and then usually by then it's resolved because people [00:14:00] understand that accountability and confrontation and good communication are really keys.

Jim: And they're making sure they don't want to go to two on one and everybody on one. They don't want that.

Sue Wilson: They don't want that.

Jim: No. Alright I wanna make sure - have you guys has an organization checked out SaferNet yet?

Sue Wilson: We actually have, and we're working on some things right now.

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SaferNet.com, it is reasonably priced. A few dollars per unit per month. And it follows you everywhere you go. It's amazing. Get it on your devices now. Make sure you tell 'em that iWork4Him sent you. SaferNet.com.

So [00:15:00] there are people listening today who are in their potential retirement years. Like the ones you're in... retirement years!

Sue Wilson: You're close. Just remember it.

Jim: Oh, but I'm five years behind you. All right. Why should they consider not retiring, but planting themselves somewhere else where they can make a difference with a purpose?

Sue Wilson: I will tell you that first of all, something that my little brother taught me, is that really retirement isn't biblical. There's nobody in the Bible that just sat on their laurels after 67 years of life. And the truth is that we are at a point in our lives where we are fully equipped to continue to breathe new life and new energy and new ideas into other people and to help equip them to be that next generation of leaders in both Christian organizations and out in the workplace.

And I, I just know that every one of us, God says, do more. The Great Commission doesn't say, [00:16:00] do this until you're 65, or stop doing this when you get the first aches in your hips. So I just know that's what he wants us doing. He wants us to be out with people. He made us and designed us to be in relationship with people, not to set ourselves aside because we have a well earned and well deserved retirement because we don't deserve that.

We have been equipped by God to continue to breathe into other people - our families, our friends, our churches, our communities, and workplaces, because most people we will see at the workplace will never actually go through the doors of a church. So where do we need to be? Where the people are, not where the people aren't.

Jim: That well deserved retirement. I deserve it. We heard that a few times. Our father was really, I deserve that. And most of the time he's talking about pie.

Okay. I can't wait to hear more about this adventure. You're, how many months into this new job are you now?

Sue Wilson: I am [00:17:00] eight months in.

Jim: Eight months in? I can't wait to see where it goes four or five years from now. But it's exciting to see that the job has really energized and motivated you as a Christian working woman who's had all these years of experience and who decided, I'm not gonna retire, I'm gonna reinvest myself into the next generation. Anything else you wanna share with the audience today before we go?

Sue Wilson: We've been talking about kingdom businesses and principles, biblical principles in businesses, but what I want you guys to understand is that every business, whether it's kingdom oriented or not, has sinful broken people in that business. So don't go into to a business thinking that you can fix them, but go into the business understanding that you're there for a purpose and that God will use you if you allow yourself to be used and just be surprised. Usually when I walk in, that's what I pray for the day: Lord, let me know how you want me to be used today. Show me where you want me.

Jim: When you walk in - that's when you go to the [00:18:00] office. What about when you walk into your home office?

Sue Wilson: I do the same thing. As I'm turning my computers on, I say, okay, Lord, what do you got for me today? Where do I need to be? Who do I need to be watching for?

Jim: Sue Wilson, thanks for coming back on iWork4Him today. That's when you're supposed to say you're welcome.

Sue Wilson: Oh, you're welcome!

Jim: All right. Good. Good deal. All right. You've been listening to iWork4Him with your host, Jim Brangenberg. I'm a Christ follower. My workplace, it's my mission field, but ultimately iWork4Him!